MC Fireside Chats, the leading podcast for the outdoor hospitality industry, is launching a new era for its Week 4 episode, spotlighting cutting-edge marketing, artificial intelligence, and technology strategies.
Tune in on Wednesday, June 25th, 2025, at 2 PM EST, as host Brian Searl, Founder & CEO of Insider Perks and Modern Campground, leads the discussion. He will be joined by recurring guests Greg Emmert, Co-founder of Camp Strategy, and Kurtis Wilkins, Private Equity Analyst of RJourney.
Special guest Sam Degenhard, Founder and CEO of Camp Fire Ranch, will also contribute, sharing insights on how direct-to-consumer models and community-building platforms are leveraging technology to redefine guest engagement and loyalty in the modern outdoor recreation space.
This episode will explore how these innovations are reshaping guest acquisition, optimizing operations, and creating enhanced experiences for campgrounds, RV parks, and glamping resorts.
June 18th Episode Recap
This episode of MC Fireside Chats, guest-hosted by Mike Harrison of CRR Hospitality, brought together a diverse panel of outdoor hospitality experts to discuss current trends, challenges, opportunities, and the unique aspects of their respective properties. The discussion highlighted the varied experiences within the campground industry, from long-standing family businesses to niche, destination-focused operations, and the ongoing impact of external factors like legislation and economic shifts.
Mike Harrison, Chief Operating Officer of CRR Hospitality, introduced himself and his company, which owns, manages, and consults on outdoor hospitality assets. He expressed excitement about guest hosting and noted the show’s weekly rotation of panelists and topics, covering trends, markets, challenges, and opportunities.
Jeff Hoffman, a founder of Camp Strategy, a consulting firm for campgrounds, shared his extensive experience, revealing he has owned his current campground since 1968, making him the most tenured in the group. His firm offers services from due diligence and feasibility studies to coaching for profitability.
Kaleigh Day, owner of Surf Junction Campground in Ucluelet, BC, described her unique, forested property located near the Pacific Rim National Park Reserve. Her campground features traditional tenting and partially/full-service sites, along with amenities like hot tubs, a sauna, flush toilets, and hot showers. A key differentiator is her surf school, operating out of the national park, alongside surf rentals, a general store, and a coffee shop. The campground has about 90 campsites across 72 acres, utilizing about 40, keeping the rest wild.
Kaleigh explained that Surf Junction’s revenue model relies on a “trifecta” of camping, surf lessons, and surf rentals. Keeping camping prices relatively low helps attract more campers, especially in the shoulder season, with additional revenue generated from add-ons like coffee, merchandise, and crucially, surf lessons and rentals, often bundled in packages. She noted that the surf school builds community and loyalty, with campers returning annually and bringing friends and family. Kaleigh’s family acquired the pre-existing Surf Junction 13 years ago when it was smaller, and they have since expanded the offerings and visibility of the surf school. She highlighted the campground’s destination appeal, being a five-and-a-half-hour journey from Vancouver, involving a ferry and a long, winding road, meaning visitors specifically choose to come to them. Reservations open in January and are typically full for the summer by June.
Stephen Saint Fort, owner of Fort Welikit Campground in Custer, South Dakota, described his 22-acre property just outside Custer, near Custer State Park and Black Hills National Forest. His campground has 100 sites, with 71 being RV sites ranging from 30-amp water and electric to 50-amp pull-throughs. A unique feature is that no two sites are alike, and the campground is heavily treed, with deer and turkey frequently seen. Stephen proudly introduced their “Camping barrels,” unique sleeping cabins that look like giant whiskey barrels, special-ordered from Norway. These barrels offer a mattress, electricity, a light, and a fan, positioned close to a bathhouse, and guests bring their own bedding. He decided to offer them as a more affordable, single-night option than full-service cabins, and they have been unexpectedly popular.
Jeff Hoffman then discussed a concerning legislative trend in Ohio, where a bill could allow county commissioners to take two-thirds of bed tax revenue for discretionary use, rather than for the visitors bureau. He shared his experience on his county’s visitors bureau, which grew from $250,000 to $4 million in revenue, and now faces demands from the county. Mike Harrison echoed these concerns, citing similar issues in Arizona where a proposed five-point bed tax increase would make a small town’s taxes among the highest in the state, potentially driving visitors to less expensive, more developed cities. Both stressed the importance of industry involvement in local, state, and national associations to combat unregulated changes that could negatively impact properties. Jeff further illustrated this point with his personal experience building a bathhouse, which saw costs nearly double due to unexpected Ohio building codes for commercial structures, contrasting it with Stephen’s experience with barrels in the Dakotas where zoning might be less stringent.
The conversation shifted to summer travel trends. Kaleigh Day noted an increase in bookings, especially in the shoulder season, with more Canadians staying within Canada and a significant rise in European visitors, particularly Germans and Dutch, who often rent RVs in the Rockies and finish their trips on Vancouver Island. She observed that tighter budgets might be leading more people to choose camping over expensive resorts. Stephen Saint Fort reported a slow May due to cold and rain. While his Canadian bookings seemed on track, he noted an influx of cancellations from Quebec specifically, but other provinces were still booking. His international bookings are higher, partly attributed to switching to an online booking company, Firefly, which simplifies the process for international travelers.
The discussion also touched on the shrinking booking window, which both Mike Harrison and Jeff Hoffman confirmed has decreased by 20-30% year-on-year, leading to more last-minute bookings. This trend suggests shorter, closer-to-home vacations. Stephen Saint Fort, however, observed that while his bookings are fewer, the average length of stay has increased from 4-5 nights to 6-7 nights, indicating guests are staying longer to explore the many attractions in the Black Hills. Kaleigh Day, conversely, prefers shorter stays (2-3 days) to maximize surf rental and lesson opportunities.
The unique identities and diverse markets of campgrounds were emphasized. Stephen Saint Fort highlighted the variety even within Custer, with 55 campgrounds within 15 miles, each catering to different guest needs, such as those prioritizing satellite TV over treed sites. Mike Harrison underscored the diversity not only in market but also in sophistication, contrasting Stephen’s recent adoption of online booking with his own properties’ long-standing reliance on it. He mentioned ongoing efforts to classify campgrounds by category to nationalize data for better trend analysis.
The panelists then discussed the prevalence of RV rentals. Kaleigh estimated that perhaps a third to half of their RV guests are in rentals, particularly Europeans, and noted a new trend of locals Airbnbing their trailers and motorhomes. Stephen estimated around 10% of his guests use rentals, often international travelers using companies like Cruise America, and also locals through RV Share. Mike Harrison identified a significant industry gap in connecting RV renters directly with campgrounds for destinations. Stephen shared his strategy of building relationships with local RV Share owners and delivery drivers, who then recommend his campground. Jeff Hoffman concurred, noting the RV rental market is relatively new (about four years old) and stressed the need for RV share operators to understand that their renters must still adhere to campground rules.
The conversation briefly veered into sports rivalries, with Kaleigh from Seattle (Seahawks fan), Stephen from Pittsburgh (Steelers fan), and Jeff from Ohio (Browns fan), adding a lighthearted moment. Mike Harrison then steered the discussion to strategies for boosting revenues. Kaleigh explained that Surf Junction diversifies revenue by heavily promoting surf lessons and rentals, incentivizing staff to upsell, and increasing marketing spend when sales are low. Stephen Saint Fort, benefiting from the self-selling Black Hills area, promotes his campground by attending travel shows and being involved with tourism organizations, noting an influx of visitors from states where he’s attended shows. He also works on improving their social media presence and collaborating with local influencers.
Jeff Hoffman advised new parks to use industry data to identify their specific market niche and consider hiring marketing firms for deep dives. For established campgrounds like his, he explained that growth is harder, now aiming for 8% rather than 10-15%. They target marketing efforts to attendees of camping shows within a three-hour drive and leverage Google Ads. As a KOA partner, his campground benefits from national marketing, allowing them to focus locally, including marketing to visitors of nearby attractions like Cedar Point amusement park and new sports facilities.
In their parting words, Stephen Saint Fort thanked everyone, reiterated the diversity of campgrounds, and offered Kaleigh advice. Jeff Hoffman also expressed gratitude, emphasized that “every campground’s different,” and offered his consulting services for initial chats without cost. Kaleigh Day found it “awesome” to chat with fellow campground operators, appreciating the insights and camaraderie within their niche career. Mike Harrison concluded by thanking all guests for their time and passion, highlighting the amazing opportunities and community within the outdoor hospitality industry.
About MC Fireside Chats
MC Fireside Chats is a live podcast experience dedicated to the outdoor hospitality and outdoor recreation industries. Hosted by Brian Searl, founder and CEO of Insider Perks and Modern Campground, the show offers engaging discussions with industry leaders, innovators, and experts shaping the future of camping, RVing, glamping, and outdoor recreation.
Airing every Wednesday at 2 p.m. (ET), the show follows a structured weekly theme to deliver deep dives into the most relevant topics:
- Week 1: Industry Trends & Insights
- Week 2: Enhancing Guest Experience
- Week 3: Business Operations & Management
- Week 4: RV Industry, Outdoor Recreation & Activities
Each episode features a panel of recurring guests, complemented by 1–2 rotating special guests, including industry analysts, campground owners, technology providers, sustainability advocates, and more. Whether exploring the latest market trends or innovative guest experience strategies, MC Fireside Chats delivers thought-provoking insights for professionals and enthusiasts across the outdoor recreation spectrum.
To explore previous episodes of MC Fireside Chats, visit: moderncampground.com/mc-fireside-chats.