MC Fireside Chats – September 25th, 2024

SPEAKER_00:

This is MC Fireside Chats, a weekly show featuring conversations with thought leaders, entrepreneurs, and outdoor hospitality experts who share their insights to help your business succeed. Hosted by Brian Searle, the founder and CEO of Insider Perks, empowered by insights from Modern Campground, the most innovative news source in the industry.

Brian Searl:

Welcome everybody to another episode of MC Fireside Chats. My name is Brian Searl with Insider Perks, upgrading my podcast studio little by little. So hopefully you guys can hear me. There’s no echo and nothing crazy is going on, but new microphone, headphones, same terrible background, same terrible face. Can’t fix those things, but I’m working on it little by little. I appreciate everybody being here. We maybe have Phil and Gracia from Elkhart. He’s popping in and out with his cell phone, kind enough to join us there live. But we have Eleanor Hamm, recurring guest here from RVD of Canada. And then we have two special guests, Becky from Blacksford RV Rentals and Nika. Is it Nika? Chill RV Rentals. I’m so busy. I don’t do my research like Eleanor was apologizing. I heard that she’s like, I didn’t do my research. I’m the host. I didn’t do my research either. So, but that’s what you guys are here to talk to us all about what the amazing things are that you do. So super excited. Eleanor, you want to just briefly introduce yourself and then we can let Nika and Becky do the same?

Eleanore Hamm:

Yeah, absolutely. So my name is Eleanor Hamm. I’m president of the RV Dealers Association of Canada and we’re a federation of provincial and regional associations. We represent the dealers across Canada and, you know, our strategic goals are sort advocacy, education, relationships, such as these, you know, just industry intelligence, and member services. So we participate once, try to participate about once a month with Brian and, and give insights on what’s happening in the RV industry.

Brian Searl:

Awesome. Well, thanks for being here, Eleanor. Becky, you want to go next?

Becky Goodell:

I’m Becky Goodell. I am the CEO of Blacksford RV Rentals. I happen to be in Elkhart today because we’re looking at Thor and Winnebago and Nexus to restock our supply. It’s my first time here. I went to college about 300 years ago at Notre Dame, but it’s Elkhart.

Brian Searl:

But it’s just me you’re looking at. You’re not looking at anyone. I’m just going to put you on the spot.

Becky Goodell:

I’m not looking what?

Brian Searl:

You’re just looking at those three manufacturers. You’re not looking at anyone else to resell.

Becky Goodell:

Well, we have we have just ongoing dealer relationships with them. But you’re right now. We should probably look at more. But anyway, Blacksburg RV Rentals is a premium RV rental business. It was started in Bozeman about six years ago, servicing Yellowstone, Glacier, Teton. We expanded to Vegas and we opened Phoenix next week. We’re all inclusive and so forth.

Brian Searl:

I definitely want to dive into that with you, because we’ve obviously heard a lot about how the market is changing. But also, I feel like the luxury market is actually, in some ways, picking up.

Becky Goodell:

We’ve seen our revenue, and we can talk about it. We’ve got to introduce Nika. We’ve seen our revenue double year over year. Nice.

Brian Searl:

It’s a good problem to have.

Becky Goodell:

It’s a good problem. We’re doubling our expenses too.

Brian Searl:

Well, that’s business, right? It happens. So Nika.

Nika Shneyder:

Hi, everyone. I’m Nika Shneyder from Chill RV Rentals. We are based out of Los Angeles. We are a family-run company. We started in 2016, so been in business a little bit over eight years now. We have 16 luxury RVs on our fleet, and at this point, I’ve hosted about 2,000 reservations, a little bit over. So we’ve seen the market shift, and I’m excited to talk all about that, and thank you for having me. I’m really excited to be here.

Brian Searl:

Yeah, I appreciate you being here. Um, we got like Phil and Susan who are doing like this. This is effort, Eleanor. Like dedication.

Eleanore Hamm:

multitasking.

Brian Searl:

Yeah, I’m not sure where Phil is going. He could be going to get luncher. Yeah, it’s like he’s muted. Oh, yeah. Oh, you’re muted. Because yeah. Okay. Can you hear me? You want to get lunch?

Phil Ingrassia:

No, no, no. I am at the store display here. The rain has stopped and everything’s going well here.

Brian Searl:

Why did you let it rain in the beginning, Phil? We need good weather.

Phil Ingrassia:

Well, you know, I have so much power, but not everything.

Brian Searl:

Susan’s back in her office. We’ll see.

Susan Carpenter:

Hello.

Brian Searl:

Hi, Susan. How are you all? Phil, I know you can, kind of the wind is going a little bit, but do you want to introduce yourself just for people real quick and then Susan do the same?

Phil Ingrassia:

Yeah, I’m Phil Ingrassia, president of the RV Dealers Association. I’m trying to get out of the wind and hopefully you can hear me all right. Yeah, we can hear you.

Brian Searl:

I feel really like guilty now having this new microphone. I mean, I should just get rid of it, Eleanor. Susan, go ahead.

Susan Carpenter:

Hi, yeah, so I’m just trying to get situated because I’m a little bit behind here. So I’m Susan Carpenter. I’m with the RV Women’s Alliance.

Brian Searl:

Welcome, Susan. Thanks for being here, as always. OK, so let’s dive into, like, first, is there anything I want to talk about where I assume you are, too, Susan, and where Becky is and where Phil is? Do we want to talk about that first, do you think, Eleanor? Or do you think we want to talk to our special guest first? You decide. You’re in charge, Eleanor.

Eleanore Hamm:

Well, we can give just a quick update about what’s happening in the industry. I mean, it is open house week in Elkhart, Indiana, where the majority of the RV manufacturers are. I’m not there. I did not travel to Elkhart this time. So I can’t tell you what’s happening on the ground this time. But it’s really become sort of the premier event for not only manufacturers to showcase new product, but also there’s a supplier component as well as at the Hall of Fame. So it’s almost like Louisville sort of has migrated to Elkhart. And it’s where the dealers go to look at new product for the upcoming season and potentially place some orders for product that they will need for 2025. And Phil and Susan, I mean, you guys are on the ground there. Feel free to add to that.

Susan Carpenter:

I was there yesterday during the downpours and the heavy rain. But it does seem to dampen the spirits, if you ask me. You know, when I was walking home, much better attended this year than it was last year.

Brian Searl:

But it hasn’t dampened the spirits is what you’re saying.

Susan Carpenter:

No, not at all.

Brian Searl:

That’s good. What are you sure? How do you know that though? Because what was this like? Maybe they would have been dancing in the streets. Everybody seemed to be really in a great mood.

Susan Carpenter:

I mean, you know, even though it was raining and everything, everybody was, I think, thankful to have the opportunity to be there. And we had an open house breakfast yesterday that was very well attended. Um, so, and, and everybody was just really optimistic of wrapping. Hopefully start a new next year.

Brian Searl:

Well, let’s talk to that man on the street in the middle of the hurricane that we see from CNN or something reporting.

Phil Ingrassia:

Yeah. Well, I’m over in the store booth and, you know, I would echo Susan’s comments that, you know, people are in a, in a very optimistic mood as we kind of, uh, get out of the trough. If I was going to say. What the overall theme of this one is, I would say it’s innovation and affordability. There’s a lot of innovative products out here. In fact, I’m in the floor booth. I’ll try to turn this around and you may be able to see that store’s electric motor home that they are having dealers test drive. It’s not full electric. It’s got a little bit of a hybrid generator motor in there, but it really is kind of the talk of the show. Also, all the manufacturers are really pushing affordability. They’re hitting price points that are kind of in line with where consumers are right now, as everybody waits for interest rates to calm down and, of course, election jitters in the US to dissipate.

Brian Searl:

So for those of us like obviously those of us on the show are familiar with this event Me less so than anybody else because I’m coming from the camping industry But we’ve had I think three years now in a row or two or three years We’ve had you guys on the show and we’ve been talking about this at various points obviously at this time of year But for those of you those of you people who aren’t familiar with the show what like Eleanor briefly introduced it, but why do we care? I mean, I know we should I’m just playing devil’s advocate

Phil Ingrassia:

Well, I think that, you know, the biggest reason that people are here is to see what’s coming down in 2025. Dealers do a lot of ordering at this show. And, you know, I will tell you, I was at the Forest River booth too. And the executives were there is how this is an opportunity for them to talk with dealers on a lot of issues that impact consumers like, you know, customer support service after the sale as well. So While there’s a big focus on new product, at the market there’s a lot of suppliers here, a lot of innovative technology that they’re building into the motorhomes and travel trailers to make them more fuel efficient, lighter, and just better for the consumer overall.

Brian Searl:

So what do you think, as you’ve been walking around, Phil, what’s the big thing that’s really, I mean, I know you touched on Thor’s electric, right? But besides that, what’s something that’s really kind of stuck out with you as it’s coming soon, and the industry is going to really be excited about it?

Phil Ingrassia:

Well, I do think that there’s… I think we might have lost Phil.

Brian Searl:

Eleanor, what is the chance that Phil got blown away? Yeah, it’s unfortunate.

Eleanore Hamm:

That was unfortunate timing. Yeah.

Brian Searl:

I just, I feel bad.

Becky Goodell:

His ear, that lovely shot of his ear.

Eleanore Hamm:

We’re just about to hear what the innovative product was. So this will be just on our, we just have to wait and see if he comes back.

Brian Searl:

Not 5G antennas on the top of the thing.

Susan Carpenter:

No, it’s a cliffhanger and it is windy out there.

Brian Searl:

Oh, there he is back. We thought you were blown away in a hurricane. So it’s good to see that you’re alive. I’ll mute myself. No, you’re fine. OK, so Becky, you’re on the ground there in Elkhart, right? Have you been able to walk around and see any things that are going on? I know we’re going to get to Blacksford, I promise you.

Becky Goodell:

We have. No, it’s our first. So my husband and I bought the majority interest in Blacks for May of 23. And so we were COVID RVers. We know, you know, we had a big class A Newmar. And we, of course, were like, oh, let’s turn our hobby into business just for kicks and giggles, you know. But so it’s our first time at the RV show. And it’s interesting to see, you know, it’s a lot of white men in polos.

Brian Searl:

You know, it’s pretty funny.

Becky Goodell:

It’s interesting. It’s just interesting. My husband is here with me and he fits that description as well. And I think what has been interesting for us, so we have certain models that we buy every year. We have 70 in our fleet right now. And what we’re seeing is they’re introducing both Winnebago and Thor, and I can’t speak to the other manufacturers, are introducing models that are the same model but cheaper. Maybe it was on a Mercedes front or chassis, and now they’re doing it on a Ram chassis or something like that. And so I think that’s really interesting because I do think, you know, without question, interest rates are affecting everything. We’re seeing it in the resale of RVs, you know, banking relationships. What I think is interesting is that I was listening to one of these from two weeks ago where you had Scott Baer and Sandy Ellingson, and they were talking about how campground bookings are down. Not everywhere, but some, and there’s some election jitters and maybe national security things and all that, and economic. We are finding the opposite in our premium market. We’re not renting Prevost, but we’re also not renting, you know, a little 10-year-old camper van with no toilet. We’re seeing a lot of, you know, people who were maybe left over. They were RV curious. They’re interested in adventure travel light. They want the comforts. They want to experience the outdoors, but they also want to have air conditioning and a refrigerator. And so what we’re seeing is demand is not softening. And maybe it’s people saying, I don’t want to make the big purchase. You know, and maybe this is true in campgrounds, too. They’re not going to buy the condo model, but they’ll go to a campground. And maybe they’re not buying RVs as much, but they’re renting them a lot. And they want the amenities.

Brian Searl:

I think that’s what we’ve seen like in our, I mean, again, in our research, right. Even on the campground side of the RV rental side, I think the luxury market is not having almost any issues right now. And that’s the same from a luxury RV resort side, other than maybe in Texas where they’ve built 700 new luxury RV resorts and they’re all competing with each other and they didn’t exist last year. But generally speaking, I think the luxury side of the market is fine and will continue to be fine. And that this will transition us into Blacksford in a second. Right. Yeah, that’s kind of where you’re going to easily come out ahead with. I mean, again, I just glanced at your website, right? But like you were talking about. So it’s interesting to me when you talk about the manufacturers and how they’re changing the chassis, because I would think that there’s less people who are perhaps able to bump up to that luxury market. But I think the luxury market is still spending and certainly Eleanor and Phil and everybody else can correct me because I’m more of a campground guy. But so it’s interesting to me that they’re downgrading those things.

Nika Shneyder:

Versus maybe the middle tier they’re taking those lower like higher to middle is interesting versus middle to lower That I think I can comment a little bit on that as well So I have 16 Mercedes minibago RVs in Los Angeles. So we do service like the luxury market I guess it’s not super luxury with the a-class buses, but with us we actually are seeing a slow in demand Now, it could be that I’m comparing it to what I’ve gone used to with COVID times, right, because during COVID everything was extra elevated. But I’m looking at our RVs, I’m looking at my competitors who are sort of in the same tier of RVs, and I am seeing demand go down and I’m seeing prices go down. And I attribute a lot of that with our market, at least, to during COVID, people were RV curious, like you said. And we compete a lot with the peer-to-peer rentals. And so I think a lot of people went out and they bought their own motorhomes, and they sort of got it out of their system. And now their motorhomes are just sitting in their driveway, and they don’t know what to do with it. And so they’re listing it. And to compete with the companies, they’re bringing down the price.

Brian Searl:

1. Thoughts, Eleanor?

Susan Carpenter:

I was just going to say, the Hershey numbers really kind of reflect that higher end, what’s being sold out there. Those numbers came out, I think, like a couple of days after the show ended.

Brian Searl:

Which were, I haven’t seen them, so do you want to briefly enlighten us?

Susan Carpenter:

So, Hershey PA. Well, I don’t remember them all, but I know like the Integra brand.

Brian Searl:

Make a round, and we’ll assume you’re correct.

Susan Carpenter:

The Integra brand, they sold 90 units of the Integras. And so, you know, that goes to show you that the people that have the money to pay without worrying about interest rates and so on are still buying and using their coaches. I think where you’re seeing a lot of the softening is the ones that are having to finance and with the higher finance rates, they’re just waiting for those to come down before they make that type of purchase. So they’re going to hang on to what they already have. That’s historically how it usually goes. Everybody thinks it’s the gas prices. No, it’s the interest rates that really kind of drive it.

Becky Goodell:

Yeah, and people who are making their money from the stock market, you see it in high-end real estate as well. My husband and I spend half the year in Naples, Florida. It’s an upscale Florida community on the Gulf Coast, hopefully not in the eye of the hurricane. It seems like it’s heading more to the panhandle. The high end is holding up. People are less rate sensitive. They’re getting their dividends and stock market gains. The market’s at a record high, but you’re seeing unemployment tick up. I think it’s going to be an interesting year.

Brian Searl:

I think it’s going to be an interesting couple of years because I think you’re going to continue to see the stock market go up. Yeah. I think you’re going to continue to see the other end of it go down. I think we’re going to see a big separation, but that’s not a conversation we need to get into because none of us are economics professors.

Becky Goodell:

I was going to respond to one of Nika’s observations, which is Blacksburg is on the pier. We’re on outdoorsy primarily. We just launched, listed some RVs for rent on RV share, and we do a ton of marketing. We do SEO and paid search, Google Ads for those of you, and paid meta. One of the things that we think we have really come forward with is just we help first-time RVers. We found Blacksford two years ago because we had friends who wanted to come on an RV trip with us and we wanted to find rentals. I’m a lawyer by training and I was like, oh, I’ll go on RV Share and Outdoorsy and I’ll find it. Then I’d read the reviews and it was like, oh, they had a cat. They canceled the night before because someone crashed it. The pictures didn’t match. It’s an older unit. It’s all these things. And I was like, I can’t recommend these rental RVs to our friends. I would feel too responsible. And so we found Blacksford. And I think the CHILL model is very similar. It’s high touch, high quality customer service and so forth. there’s still a demand for that. And so while we are more, we are definitely 10, 20% more than what you could get maybe the same RV through Outdoorsy or RV Share. But people are saying, I want the guarantee that you’ll send a mobile mechanic, that you have 24-7 with the local manager, you have a mechanic there. If our RV breaks, we come and replace it. Like if it’s, you know, if it’s not just reset the whatever, and we come and replace it. We have extra RVs to do that. And I think people, when they’re spending their valuable time, right? This is a bucket list trip. They’ve always wanted to go RVing. They want that peace of mind.

Nika Shneyder:

Yeah, I mean, yeah, I completely agree with you. We sell it the same way. Is that when you’re renting from some, from an individual owner, uh, you don’t know, maybe there’ll be gets into an accident the day before and then they don’t have an RV to replace it with. Whereas with us, we’re a company and that comes with certain guarantees.

Brian Searl:

Do you, um, or do you do the same kind of marketing Nika or that she was talking about her? Because I think that’s a big difference maker. And I don’t know if I’m lagging by the way, I feel like I’m lagging. But I feel like that’s a big difference maker for us when we’re like, cause that’s my other hat that I wear is I do marketing for like 500 campgrounds and RV parks. And so we kind of see the same thing. Like my guidance to them is the market is softening. The market is shrinking, whether it’s, you know, normalizing from COVID years, but also the economy is going down, but also the luxury market is fine. All the nuances, right? But I think there’s plenty of people still to make the camping industry perfectly healthy. I’m not worried about it. But it’s not just a, you build it and they will come anymore. It’s a, you build it and do marketing and they will come. And then your competitors are going to suffer because you’re marketing correctly. So is that something that you’re also in Nika?

Nika Shneyder:

Yeah, absolutely. We run Google ads. Um, we run some Facebook and Instagram ads. I haven’t, to be honest, I haven’t seen too much success with advertising and maybe I’m just not doing it right. Cause I am sort of doing it most of it myself. Um, you know, we’re a smaller company. Where I’ve seen most of my success in getting new customers is through word-of-mouth client referrals. We give our clients a little bonus if they refer somebody, and then we give their friends a little discount if they got referred to us, and also reviews. Reviews are absolutely essential to us. We rank really highly on Yelp. We rank really highly on Google just because we do really ask our clients to leave those reviews.

Brian Searl:

I don’t, I don’t want to take away from the RV show and talk about Blacksford and chill RV rentals. So like, I won’t get too far into this, but I would just say that, like, I think it’s a tracking thing, probably. And what I mean is your Google ads could be working, your Facebook ads could be working, your word of mouth for sure is working, because people come in the door and they’re like, hey, I heard about it from this other person who was your and then you know. So just maybe like talk to a consultant and see like, how do I track the forums? How do I track the bookings? How do I track the context stuff, and figure out how to put a value on that. And then you can actually have data that shows you whether it’s working for real or not. And then you know, right?

Nika Shneyder:

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Right.

Brian Searl:

So, okay. So let’s, uh, let’s start with chill RV rentals right here. We might as well, then I don’t have to click my camera. I can be late, the things around. So, uh, Nika, tell us like, uh, obviously you talked a little bit about, you know, the product you offer and things like that, but how did you get started? What was the problem you were trying to solve here with chill RV rentals?

Nika Shneyder:

Well, we got started in 2016 and to tell you the truth, the way we got started is we weren’t really trying to solve a problem. We were trying to create a new and exciting business to work in. It was my dad’s idea, so it’s a family company. We were a camping family, always tent camping because it was nice and cheap. We’re Ukrainian immigrants, so we were trying to stretch the dollar a lot. my dad got invited on a camping trip and somebody showed up with a motorhome from the 90s but my dad super loved it and was like I need to get one and went to my mom told her he wants to buy a motorhome and she said absolutely not we can’t afford one and so my dad being an entrepreneur that he has started thinking about well how can I possibly convince my wife to let me get a motorhome And he thought, OK, what if we rent it out? And this was right as RV Share and Outdoorsy were gaining traction. And we did our competitor research, saw that we could buy really nice Winnebago Mercedes motorhomes and rent them at the same price as Cruise America. And we would still be making good money on it. And that’s what we did. We bought one RV, listed it on Outdoorsy, RV Share, Craigslist, Facebook. And God booked out like within a week for the whole summer. It was insane. Um, which tells me we were priced way too low, but that was really exciting because we’re like, okay, so then there is a market for this. So literally within the month we went out and bought three more and we financed them all. And then it just sort of snowballed from there.

Brian Searl:

So I know Becky’s talked about this briefly and we’ll get to you Becky with more Blacksford, right? But, but I know Becky has talked about this briefly, the difference maker between You know, for your example, for chill RV rentals and an outdoorsy or an RV share. So what is that in your mind? What sets you apart?

Nika Shneyder:

Well, exactly. Like Becky had mentioned, is that when you rent with a company, you get the guarantee that like, if something’s broken, we know how to fix it. I can’t tell you how many times I have people call me and they’re like, Hey, I rented with so and so company, and I’m calling them nonstop. I’m having this issue. My generator won’t start or my car won’t start. And they’re just, they’re not replying. They’re not answering their phone. It’s going to voicemail and I’m stuck here and I don’t know what to do. Can you help me? So.

Brian Searl:

I’m interested, and I want to come back to you in a second, but I just I want an independent opinion from either Eleanor or Phil or Susan, just somebody who’s not like a direct competitor of Outdoorsy or RV Share. I’m curious, and I know this is a dangerous question to wade into, but do we have a sense of how many RVs on that are listed on these platforms have problems that cause the person who’s renting them to have a negative opinion of the RV industry?

Phil Ingrassia:

Do we have a sense of… Well, it’s kind of hard to say. I do believe that when I’m providing advice to people who are renting, you have to make sure that there is a company behind the product that you’re renting. Because as they’ve outlined, things can happen. And if you’re on one of the platforms and somebody doesn’t return it on time, it crashes, your trip is interrupted. and maybe cancel because there’s nothing behind the company to make it right. So, you know, that’s one of the main things through the RV Rental Association we try to stress when we’re communicating with the public and the business press. You know, the other thing is, is that as, you know, our Dorsey and RV Share, the people on those platforms have turned it into a real business, then they see, that it has to be run like a business and it isn’t just, you know, when I’m not using it type of a thing. So we’re seeing a lot of people who started out on those shared platforms now turning it into a business and now coming to RVRA or some other, you know, professional group and say, okay, how do I make this work? You know, what do we need to do? And where’s the insurance, the financing, how does that all line up so that we can have a successful business?

Brian Searl:

I don’t want to go too far down this path, because obviously I believe that if we did go down that path, that Outdoorsy and RV Share obviously have a rebuttal in their side of the story. And maybe it’s not obviously as bad as we’re singling out a couple of things here. But it is interesting to think about the all the people that came into our industry to purchase RVs during COVID who had never had it before, whose experience was brand new, and we’ve talked previously about the service needs for new RVs, but this is also a whole other game of like, what if my first experience in an RV is the guy canceled on my trip, or it got crashed, or it was dirty, or I was allergic to cats, or something like that. And that impacts, down the line, everything they’re willing to do in the future. And again, I’m not saying this is something Outdoorsy or RVShare have a problem with, but it is happening in some capacity, right?

Phil Ingrassia:

Well, yeah, I would just say that it isn’t an Outdoorsy, RVShare, or any other platform issue specifically. It’s a person. It’s not it’s it’s it’s a matter of you know, how are what kind of experience are you expecting? and if you’re expecting a good, you know a Seamless experience then you need to go to a professional rental company If you’ve got more flexibility or whatever maybe running from an individual works It’s it’s just it’s it all centers on expectation experience. And of course the price you want to pay

Brian Searl:

Which is always, yeah, the disclosure of everything, right? And you’re never gonna, and I guess the problem then really on outdoorsy or RV share is you can’t police people being honest about how they’re describing their RV, right? The guy who had the cat is never gonna describe his RV is like come stay in the middle of cat tender if you love cats Like that’s just not gonna happen, right? And I don’t think that there’s any realistic way It’s just like we hear about all the content moderation from Facebook and Instagram and there’s no realistic way that this is gonna happen So I think that’s kind of like I think you’re right is what I’m saying. It’s not an outdoorsy or RV share problem, but indirectly like it is a consequence of their business model and whether that’s 0.001% or 5% or whatever that number is, nobody knows.

Becky Goodell:

I think they’re fabulous.

Phil Ingrassia:

Your rental guests would have more information on that. Your rental guests use those platforms. I think they’ve tightened it up, but I think they would have more insight than I would on that.

Nika Shneyder:

I also would like to say one more thing. about our Dorsey and our ReShare. I am incredibly, like Becky was saying, they are fabulous platforms. They’re fabulous. I am incredibly grateful that they were, I’m sorry, Brian. I’m really grateful that they were around because if it wasn’t for those platforms, I wouldn’t have been able to build my business. Because now we do most of our business through our own website, but we absolutely started with our ReShare. And I will say there is also still an interesting market for why people would choose to go with Outdoorsy and RV Share versus a private company. So we do consignment vehicles. We have certain consignment partners. And I’ve taken on consignment vehicles and then I’ve given them right back because they were just too complicated or too expensive for me. And now those people, like, for example, I had a partner who had an Airstream Mercedes RV, Atlas. It’s like a $300,000 RV. And the price point, it didn’t make sense for me to rent it. My renters didn’t want to pay how much it should have cost. And there wasn’t enough profit in it for me. So I said, I’m not going to manage this vehicle for you anymore. Here, go listed on Outdoors A&R Reshare.

Brian Searl:

He did and he’s just trying to offset his payments a little bit But you can find unique vehicles like that that maybe a company wouldn’t necessarily take on Yeah, and again, I like I know that’s a very fine line I’m not at all criticizing outdoor Z or RV share like everybody has you know, like I have thousands of criticisms about myself, right? And so I know that’s a fine line to walk, but I just think it’s an interesting discussion to have generally speaking

Becky Goodell:

Well, I think though it’s interesting. You know we have three locations, two until next week. Then we’re three and we do. I don’t know 1500 rentals a year. Let’s say maybe that’s somewhere 1000 to 1500 averaging a week. We get once a week a walk in at one of our locations who either their RV their peer to peer canceled or. Cruise America, they showed up, they flew into Bozeman, they flew into Vegas, and they don’t have the RV. And they’re like literally standing there with their luggage and like, we have campground reservations. We have all this, what am I going to do? And this is not the stand. I mean, we’re not really trying to compete with cruise America and I don’t mean to diss them, but things happen. Right. And with a little company like chill or Blacksford, we are carefully managing every reservation and fully aware when an RV is going out, when it’s coming back, what shape it’s in, what work it needs to. have done so forth and we’re constantly in touch with our customers while they’re on their trip. You know, they can reach out to us, we can reach out to them. you know, that sort of thing. So, you know, we’re niche players.

Brian Searl:

A large company and a smaller company too. I think there’s benefits to both, right? For sure. Not even just, you know, outdoorsy versus like a private, like we’re talking about. This is a whole nother, this is car rentals, right? Like look at the difference between Alamo and National or Enterprise. Like it’s the same company, but there’s different levels of cars or, you know, like I want to go budget or I want to go more expensive. Like, I only rent from National when I travel primarily because I have a credit card that gives me great benefits and I get upgrades but also I know National like the way they pass down their cars is they only have them at National from 0 to 20,000 miles and then they go to Alamo or Enterprise. And so I know I always get new cars and I always have that better experience. But even beyond that, there’s still a market again for like the Blacksford of car rentals, which is getting a private driver like we did in Manila. Like I didn’t want to drive in Manila. It was like, it’s horrific. You’ll never figure out the traffic laws. You’ll crash and die and burn and everything will be horrible. And so we hired a driver and it was great. But so I think there’s always going to be a market for different levels of that. But you’re right. Like there’s never anything that’s going to replace the touch of a smaller company. who can give that care and attention in detail. It’s just a question of are you able to or willing to pay for it, right?

Nika Shneyder:

And I think the middle tier is sort of a really nice sweet spot too versus a company like Cruise America or Monte Road Bears because when it comes to client support, my experience with my renters is that When they rent from national giants like that, if something’s going on in the RV that’s a little bit different than maybe what those agents are used to, they don’t really know how to help short of, well, let me cancel your trip or tow your RV somewhere. Whereas with our 16 vehicles, you know, we know them in and out and anything that could possibly go wrong, I’ve seen it and I know how to fix it. And if I don’t know how to fix it, I’ll bring you a new one. Or I’ll write one for my competitor if I’m all sold out, and then I’ll bring you a new one. And I think that’s reflected in our reviews and ratings as well.

Brian Searl:

I mean, that’s the again, that’s the small company thing, right? Like, if you talk to Jennifer, who co founded outdoorsy, and you could get her on the phone, she’d do the same thing for you. But it’s impossible for her to do that for 20,000 people a day. And so the person you’re going to get on the phone from outdoorsy is probably nice and kind and willing to help, but doesn’t know all the things Jennifer does, or Nika does, or Becky does. And so it’s just impossible for them to, they’ve never seen that thing before to help you with it, right? Even if they wanted to. So again, not criticism of outdoorsy or RV share, just different models, different ways of thinking, different ways that business works, and all of them thrive together to make sure the entire market is serviced, right? So okay, so back to chill RV rentals, we got distracted there for a while. So chill RV rentals, you started telling us about it, not the problem you were solving, but the family business and how to get into it and stuff. So what would you say, like we’ve talked about your service, what would you say is something that you really like, you know your customers have to get right when they rent from you? Like what an expectation that they have that would set, I don’t know, we have kind of covered that too. Maybe I don’t have a good question for once in my life, Eleanor. Yeah. Does anybody else want to ask a question? No, but, um, so with chill RV, like what, what are you trying, where are you going to go with the business? What are you trying to expand into? What are you trying to, where do you want to stake your claim?

Nika Shneyder:

Yeah, it’s a really great question. So there’s two things that, two places where I’m really looking to pivot my business right now. The first one is Burning Man. So we love Burning Man. I know most people in the RV industry don’t, but it’s a huge money maker for us. And it’s just a really, there’s such a big demand there. And there’s not a lot of companies that are willing to service that demand. So the profits, profit margins there are phenomenal.

Brian Searl:

Sorry, just is that because of the fact that it is so hard to get RVs there or because there’s a potential of them being damaged or

Nika Shneyder:

Everything. So the first part of it is that a lot of RV companies don’t want their vehicles going there. Becky, do you guys send your vehicles to Burning Man?

Becky Goodell:

We don’t. Part of it is insurance. And the bigger part is the risk of damage to the vehicles. And some of that, a lot of that is just from the dust getting in. I know people do tape the windows with the blue and the whole thing, but we just haven’t been willing to do it. We’ll do Coachella. We’ll do any other music, probably any other music festival. I don’t know if there’s some crazy one or whatever.

Brian Searl:

Nobody really watches the show anyway, but still don’t back yourself into a corner.

Becky Goodell:

Exactly, exactly. No, but we have made the decision. I push to see like, why not? Why not? Because I know that the profits are huge. But what’s your experience been with chill in the RVs at Burning Man?

Nika Shneyder:

Fabulous. So you’re right in that the dust gets into everything, absolutely. And when it comes back, it needs like a week’s worth of service. So all the oil, all the filters, deep cleaning, the slide outs needs to be cleaned. I mean, last year when it was a wet year and there was all this mud, we literally had to take the wheels off. Oops. We literally have to take the wheels off and wash it. But my experience is we do a lot of preparation work for Burning Man. So you’re right. We seal all the windows inside, outside. We seal the floors. We seal all the carpets, any cloth materials. I mean, we do two days worth of prep for it. And then when we go, I actually go myself just because I enjoy Burning Man. And I bring a ton of equipment with me. I bring extra ACs. I bring a little portable refrigerator. I bring two additional generators. I bring all the little parts that could go wrong, water pumps, light regulators. I mean, literally everything. And if something happens, I mean, that’s one of the things that I upsell for is that I’m going to be there on the playa, that if something should happen, I can come by and help you out. I’ve hosted for nine burns already, and the worst thing that’s ever happened is maybe a stalled out generator. We had somebody burn out the water pump this year. Last year, we had an RV get stuck in the mud, but they didn’t have reception, so they didn’t call me, so it wasn’t my problem. But the community came together, and they pushed the RV out, and that’s that, and that was fine. So we’ve, you know, knock on wood, we’ve truly never really had any problems with it. you know, for a week, we get to sell the RV instead of a regular $2,000 for a week, we get to sell it for $14,000. And, you know, the cleaning price and the hassle. Absolutely. Yeah. And absolutely. Yeah. And we only sell the RVs for Burning Man. And then next year, I think I even want to consign more RVs and we’re putting on our own camp next year. So we’re going to do, um, commercial generators and a big water supply. you know, and like more of a turnkey experience with bike rentals and everything like that. I mean, people are, you know, we’re talking about luxury market and there’s still being a market for that. For a Burning Man, I’ve never seen a drop in demand. And the insurance aspect, you’re right on that, is that Outdoorsy doesn’t allow RVs to go to Burning Man. Their insurance won’t cover it. But RV Share still does, and hopefully they continue to. But if not, you know, then we just there’s enough demand to where we can find clients that will supply their own insurance for that.

Brian Searl:

So we’ve got a lot of takeaways here, Eleanor. I want to talk about Black Swan in a second. But Eleanor, we need to loop Kara into this, because what we’re basically hearing is for the RV industry to work better with campgrounds, they don’t need Wi-Fi. Get rid of the Wi-Fi. So if there’s problems with their RV,

Eleanore Hamm:

Exactly, you just never hear about it. It’s great.

Brian Searl:

I mean, we’ve been telling people to upgrade their Wi-Fi at campgrounds in Canada for so long, and this is no, this is wrong. We’ve got to send Kara an email right now. Okay, so Blacksburg, let’s switch to Blacksburg real quick, so we want to make sure we get enough time in here with Becky, like we obviously talked about. I’m looking at your website right now in another tab, right? Premium RV rental. What does premium mean to Blacksburg?

Becky Goodell:

Premium means we’re giving you brand new, We bought 35 or 40 RVs this year. And we have some that are from last season. They’re brand new premium RVs. They’re not Privos. We have Views, we have Revels, we have, these are Winnebago products, Echoes, most of them retail between 100 plus to 200. We added a Thor Quantum LC28 because we needed something with six seat belts and slept six. But it doesn’t just mean the RV. We include the sheets and the towels and the kitchen stuff and the camp chairs and We include unlimited mileage, which is really unusual, and unlimited generator usage. But we also spend anywhere from one to three hours with each customer going through a detailed orientation. Most people are not seasoned RVers. Occasionally we get them. They’re like, oh, our RV’s in Maine. We want to see Yellowstone. We don’t want to drive it all the way out here. We just flew. For the most part, people are unfamiliar with, you know, the Class Cs are more complicated than the Bs, obviously, like showing them. We have, I think we have 20 Solis, which is a Class B camper van. And those are much simpler with a cassette toilet and so forth. But we are going to teach you how to use this RV. really, really well before you pull out and you’re going to feel really comfortable. We had this couple from New York, New York City over the summer in Bozeman. And the guy’s like, you know, typical and stereotypical New Yorker. And he’s like, we’re going to die. We are going to die. Do you think we’re going to die? And I mean, he was truly he was being funny, but he was a nervous wreck. And, you know, I don’t even know if they have a car in New York. Right. New Yorkers a lot of times have cars. And by the time he drove out two hours later, And he’s like, I got this. And he was texting us on trip, sending us pictures. And he’s like, this is so empowering. And so it’s premium service. When you pull out of our garage bay in your Blacksburg rental, you have a 24-7 phone number for our manager, assistant manager. who can diagnose and fix any problem. We are, you know, doing all the things that, Nika, we replace RVs, we send mobile mechanics, we send our mechanics, we do all these things. So that’s sort of what I mean by premium. And our reviews, like Nika’s, I’m so glad we’re not competitors, Nika. You know, we literally, our average is five stars. We We don’t get anything less than a five-star review. And they make you want to cry. They’re so good. People will send us thank you notes in addition to leaving reviews. They’re like, this was a bucket list experience. This was so meaningful. You made it so easy. I was so nervous. Everyone was so friendly and helpful in every way, shape, or form. So that’s premium to us.

Brian Searl:

So when you go to a show like you’re at right now in Elkhart, like what are you looking for for your company? What are you trying to find that will make you like, how do you make a decision of what to buy next year?

Becky Goodell:

Well, we like to run the same vehicles, right? Because there’s continuity. And, you know, we are advertising and our marketing and our website, and they all have, you know, our SEO and things like that. It’s those four or five vehicles we’ve talked about. And people like them. They’re good, solid vehicles. And so part of what we’re doing is we’re negotiating price, right? We’re like, OK, oh, wait, the Revel on the Mercedes chassis is $15,000 or $20,000 more than the Revel on the non-Mercedes chassis. We’re looking at that. We’re looking for innovations. and trying to understand some of, you know, banking considerations. We, you know, who’s going to help us finance these RVs? We own many of them outright, but we also, you know, banking is not easy. Everyone wants to do a traditional flooring line, which is like for an RV dealer, as opposed to we’re not selling these in three months. We’re not selling them in six months. So we’re really trying to build relationships with our sales people and the sales teams at the manufacturers and see if there’s anything new. And, you know, we saw some really cool class B’s at Thor today that I’d never seen. I was like, these are really cool. And so we’re going to go back and think about some of these.

Brian Searl:

So hypothetical question, like you mentioned these three manufacturers that are obviously big players and have, make really good products, right? What would it take for a new manufacturer to break in with you? And you’d be like, oh, wow, I need to buy five or 10 of those tomorrow. What would it take for you, hypothetically?

Becky Goodell:

That’s an excellent question. It’s one we’ve thought about recently. I think some of it would be, you know, we resell these vehicles. We are terrible at reselling them. And we We’re really good at renting and we’re trying in the last year to, you know, when for during COVID, you didn’t, you could just like put a sign out. If even that people were lining up to buy them and they’d pay over what we paid. And it was so easy and we got complacent. We’re like, this is so easy. It’s really not easy. And, you know, I get RV dealers are. They know what they’re doing. They know how to sell. They know how to do the marketing. It’s different than marketing for rentals, right? It’s a totally different niche. And so we are trying through RV Trader to sell our RVs, and we’re trying through other ways to sell our RVs and advertising. It would be help on the resale and the financing. If somebody said to us, you We’ll buy these back. One of our dealers will sell these, you know, or whatever. Or we have a bank that’s going to give you something that’s not a flooring line. Those are the sorts of things. It would have to represent the same quality. You know, we love Winnebago and we love Thor. They’re also big companies. you know, they are bureaucracies. They’re not always as nimble as we as a little nimble company would like, right? They have their own systems and well, the sales guy said they do this and then it goes to the finance people and they’re like, oh no, no, no, no, we can’t, we can’t do that. So I guess that’s a long way of, inside baseball way of saying they’d have to work with us.

Brian Searl:

Phil or Eleanor, are there any like programs where not necessarily working with smaller niche manufacturers, but how to, like, is there any programs where dealers are working with RV rental companies to either, you know, temporarily replace somebody’s unit while it’s in service or, you know, somebody comes in and they really want to buy, but they maybe don’t qualify for financing or they want to get into the industry, but they don’t really like, they want to intro into it first. Like, is there anything that exists like that?

Eleanore Hamm:

Well, I mean, you know, our, We mostly represent obviously some rental dealers in Canada as well. And I know in terms of selling the product, I mean, they do, they usually use it for a year or two and then sell it off. So they’re not, but they’re not, most of them are not just, I mean, there are a couple that are just rentals, but a lot of them will have a sales component as well. So they kind of funnel their rental product line into their sales cycle when they’re trying to replenish and restock. So that, you know, versus with Becky where they’re uniquely detrimental. So, you know, maybe trying to work with the dealership in your area, right? Directly as well, not just relying on the manufacturer, but maybe establishing some of those relationships with existing dealers that might have that product line that potentially could They may not be in transfers, they may be able to sell them as pre-owned units, that might be some way. I never really thought about it. The interesting part that you mentioned was the financing side of it, because yes, the floor plan is a model that’s based on turns and getting that product off of the lot very quickly. So, you know, that’s an interesting one. I hadn’t really thought about it. I don’t know if Phil has anything on that side of it. But usually, yeah, the most of the members that are the floor plan companies, they don’t have that model open, you know, for the more geared towards selling dealers.

Becky Goodell:

And there’s also no certified pre-owned. We were talking to Winnebago today about that. you know, they are interested in potentially piloting, nothing is set in stone, a certified pre-owned. You know, we’re small enough and professional enough that they’re interested in doing this, but there’s not a certified pre-owned, and that would certainly, product out there, that would certainly help with resale.

Eleanore Hamm:

Yeah. I’m going to just do a plug. The Arboretum of Canada has a certified pre-owned program for our dealers to use. So sorry it’s not available in the U.S.

Becky Goodell:

Let’s talk. Let’s talk.

Brian Searl:

I’m in Calgary. Just come up here. We got plenty of people who want to see Vancouver and Toronto. Sorry, Phil.

Phil Ingrassia:

That’s fine. You know, I think over the years manufacturers have, you know, kind of launched rental fleet programs and then kind of stepped away from them. A lot of it depends on what the sales environment is for those motorhomes. And so during COVID times when, you know, the dealers were ordering everything they could, But this may be a time now where the industry is building back to put some of those programs in place and institutionalize them so that when people at the manufacturing management change, the programs are still there. And I’m sure that if you went to Thor and Winnebago and they went in their files and dusted off some rental programs, they’d find some rental programs that probably worked pre-COVID.

Becky Goodell:

Yeah, I mean, I don’t know if Nika’s found this. Sometimes I feel, and we love our manufacturers, but sometimes you feel a little bit like a round peg in a square hole, or maybe like the stepchild that, you know, we’re not the dealers buying thousands of models every year. We’re sort of consistent and small and we’re growing, but they don’t quite know

Brian Searl:

what to do with us.

Becky Goodell:

My husband has the same problem with me, too. He’s like, I don’t know what to do with you.

Brian Searl:

So as you’re hearing these ideas, Phil, just maybe the model is Eleanor, as I’m not familiar with it, right? But how hard is this kind of logistically to say, like, we want to investigate or start researching or figure out if a certified pre-owned thing is a thing that would work in the US?

Phil Ingrassia:

Well, there are programs through service agreement companies where you can put a service agreement on a used RV and sell it with confidence to the… Sort of extended warranty? Yeah, exactly. And warranties that they’ll put on. So there is some of that going on sort of at the dealer level right now. It’s not a nationwide program, but certainly they’re working with their insurance agents and their extended warranty or service agreement companies to do that. The other thing to put in a plug for the RV dealers convention coming up in November in Las Vegas is a lot of the manufacturers will be there. and doing dealer meetings and things like that. It’s a great opportunity for not only dealers who buy to sell, but also rental dealers who buy from those companies to talk with that upper level management and maybe put the bug in their ear. Hey, this is a growing segment of the industry. We can help each other and it helps prime the pump for future sales.

Becky Goodell:

Yes, Blacksford will be there. My husband, I, and a couple of our our general manager. So we’ll have a drink.

Brian Searl:

But then it’s really just trust in the consumer standpoint, right? Like how do we get a consumer to like Eleanor, how many consumers do you think in Canada have heard of the certified program and know that they can completely trust it, right?

Eleanore Hamm:

That’s a small percentage for sure. We try to market to consumer magazines as well. Uh, not just our dealer body engage in it and their marketing materials, but it’s, it’s, yeah, it’s probably a small segment of the pre-owned product.

Brian Searl:

I mean, I think it just like, it’s gotta be somebody that the consumers can easily identify with, right. Something or some program where they can quickly get like a, like a verified by Phil stamp. Everybody knows Phil. Like I want Phil to inspect my RV and say he approves it.

Becky Goodell:

It’s like the good housekeeping seal of approval.

Brian Searl:

Yeah. Yeah. Or, uh, Phil could be the Martha Stewart of, I don’t know. Like everybody knows Martha, except don’t do anything illegal, Bill.

Phil Ingrassia:

I saw a Laura Ashley themed travel trailer today. Laura Ashley. Wow. Very nice.

Brian Searl:

So, all right, we got a couple more minutes left. Is there anything we haven’t touched on that I’ve forgotten? Feels like the show’s gone quicker than normal.

Eleanore Hamm:

How was your breakfast, Susan? You touched on it briefly.

Susan Carpenter:

Yeah, we had standing room only breakfast. So we always open the open house with our RVWA breakfast where we have two motivational and corporate speakers that come in and teach neat kind of fun things. Breakfast is always great. The hot coffee considering it starts at 7 a.m. always goes very quickly. And then we also launched our we’re doing a charity collaboration with I Support the Girls. And Eleanor, you’ll be happy about this. It’s across the border.

Eleanore Hamm:

So we have a couple chapters in Canada as well.

Susan Carpenter:

Yeah. Yeah. So it’s about donating and collecting sanitary products for women that and girls that are in need through poverty, homelessness and natural disasters. And it’s amazing on how not available it is for these ladies out there. So we’re doing a huge drive to collect at least 80,000 pieces. We’re already at 11,000 and we’re only a couple of days into the six-month thing. So I think we’re going to blow it out of the water. But what’s fun about it is we do, we have RVDA of Canada and Great Canadian RV. both coming in on this and collecting up in Canada as well through our Amazon wish list and donation sites. So whatever’s dropped off in Canada stays in Canada, which is pretty exciting.

Brian Searl:

Do you have, did I see something about an awards program or something? Is that now or later?

Susan Carpenter:

Yeah, so next month we have our symposium in Chicago where we have awards that we give out. It’s the Trailblazer Award for any person over 25 years that have paved the trail for other women in this industry. We have Champion of Women for Company and a Champion of Women for a Personal, and those are just either a company or a person that had, you know, champions women in the RV industry. And then we have the leader of tomorrow award. Um, these are young ladies or men that are, you know, really blazing the trail. And, uh, we have our eyes on them to be exponential in the future.

Brian Searl:

I think it’s like, and Anakin, I don’t know too much about your awards, like just guilty of not having enough time to read. Like I did see a LinkedIn post about it. Right. That’s how I was aware of the whole thing. But I think it’s really it’s really interesting and I’ve never maybe thought of an awards program at all like this But it’s really interesting that the segmentation I think is so important to tomorrow’s leaders versus today’s leaders versus old young small medium like like just that segmentation sometimes I think not in your case, but maybe it like oh highs awards or something with small medium, whatever parks and Tends to be a little bit like 1% divisive But I think it’s so important sometimes to recognize the people that like you’re saying over 25 You’ve got to have enough time to prove yourself, right?

Susan Carpenter:

Yeah They’re doing great things at a very young age and it’s kind of like watch out for these These ladies that they’re gonna they’re gonna do great things as they get older as well so we like to recognize those people and they’re all nominated by either their peers their companies or You know like Nika Exactly, exactly.

Brian Searl:

Wait, Nika’s nominated?

Becky Goodell:

No, I was saying she’s like young and young. Yeah. Or she’s had a great facelift. But yeah, young and up and coming and doing great things.

Susan Carpenter:

And you too should join RVWA. It’s open for anybody who’s in the RV industry. That’s that’s rentals, campgrounds, dealerships. It’s free of charge at RVWA.org. We do really great things. You get to network with people from all different segments of the industry. It’s really fun. place to belong.

Brian Searl:

I don’t want to be selfish here, but can we go back to the facelifts? Because have you seen this? Like I really need, can we just set up a form and people can submit like who your favorite facelift person is?

Susan Carpenter:

You gotta own it, Brian. Just own it.

Brian Searl:

Like I can’t do everything I already own like this little second brain I have on the top of my head So like I’m getting there, right? That’s a big leap so anyway See like we have you on the show for a reason Susan Harvey did but it’s it’s just interesting just to close my thought on that whole thing It’s like I really started Thinking about that like I’ve always thought I’ve always been of the mindset that like Maybe there’s an opportunity to be less selective young and old is like, you know up-and-comers a different thing, right? But I was actually in the Manila Airport on my on my trip and they board the plane and they like they have the groups but the first people to board after the people who need assistance for the kids is seniors and Like if you’re a senior, it doesn’t matter what kind of ticket, where you’re sitting or whatever else. And they don’t define senior as an age, just if you’re senior and you think you’re senior, come board the plane first. And so that was really cool. Because I think that’s a very good initiative.

Susan Carpenter:

It gives us something to look forward to for a change.

Becky Goodell:

That and infirmities, right?

Brian Searl:

So all right, any final thoughts we have here? We’re going to run a little bit over here. I think we already lost Phil. But any final thoughts from you ladies?

Nika Shneyder:

This was so fun. Thank you so much for having us on. Yeah, thank you very much.

Eleanore Hamm:

I look forward to seeing some of you in Las Vegas.

Brian Searl:

I wish I could be there. It always overlaps. Eleanor won’t move it just for me. I have to go to Ojai. I’m a campground guy. I don’t know what to tell you. I got to exhibit. I got to do everything. But one day I’ll make it there when it’s without cloning. But thank you, Susan. I appreciate you being here from the RV Women’s Alliance. Glad to hear everything’s going perfect for you. Thanks, Nika, for joining us from Chill RV Rentals. Exciting to learn about your company. Becky, all the best as well. Maybe I’ll have to come maybe rent from your company sometime.

Becky Goodell:

Absolutely.

Brian Searl:

You have my email. My problem is I drove all the way around the States when I was starting my company, like bootstrapping in a Jeep. So I’ve seen everything I need to see in the States. Like I think so right from an outdoor hiking perspective So that’s my problem with the RV rentals like they’re great, but I got to get down there I gotta find something interesting enough for me to rent an RV is what I’m saying.

Becky Goodell:

Give me a call.

Brian Searl:

We’ll make it happen All right, Eleanor as always from RVD of Canada appreciate you being here to fill to just I told him thank you Appreciate you guys joining us for another episode of MC fireside chats. We will see you next week again and see you later. Bye.

Nika Shneyder:

Thanks

SPEAKER_00:

This episode of MC Fireside Chats with your host, Brian Searle. Have a suggestion for a show idea? Want your campground or company in a future episode? Email us at hello at moderncampground.com. Get your daily dose of news from moderncampground.com. And be sure to join us next week for more insights into the fascinating world of outdoor hospitality.