MC Fireside Chats – July 15th, 2026

[00:00:45] Brian Searl: Welcome everybody to another episode of MC Fireside Chats. My name is Brian Searl with Insider Perks and Modern Campground. Hopefully we’re actually live guys. If not we’ll just have to like premiere this as an episode later.

 I hit the go live and it was like, I don’t know if I want to go live and just sat there so I pushed it again and it said stop and then we started. So I don’t know if everything’s in chaos now, but either way we’ll have a good episode and we’ll premiere it live if we need to later on the different various social media networks. So how’s everybody doing today? We’re excited to be back for our third week episode of July already.

 Can you guys believe summer is almost over already? 

[00:01:16] Wendy Heineke: Crazy. 

[00:01:17] Brian Searl: Like yeah, I feel like time is just going crazy in 2026, super fast. Exciting year.

 So let’s just go around and briefly introduce ourselves. We have a couple of current guests. We have Mike Harrison from CRR. We have Sandy Ellingson who may or may not be able to talk, she’s driving down the road which feels extremely unsafe.

Uh, I wanna just sign a disclaimer of liability with her to absolve my trail of all issues should she get distracted on the road or something. But, uh, and then we have a couple special guests, so let’s just go around the ribbon, introduce ourselves, and briefly tell us about yourselves. You want to start Mike?

[00:01:50] Mike Harrison: Sure. There’s no way Sandy is driving. Look how she’s sitting in the chair. Like if she’s driving in that current seated position, I I like I don’t know, she got her feet up or what.

 But uh yes, good afternoon. Happy summer. Uh happy mid summer I guess. I mean we’re almost exactly at the halfway point through the year.

 My name is Mike Harrison, uh Chief Operating Officer of CRR Hospitality. We own and manage uh beautiful luxury RV resorts, uh manufactured home neighborhoods, storages, car wash, a lot of different type of uh assets and hospitality assets. And we also do third party management and consulting uh for many uh clients in the industry as well.

[00:02:31] Brian Searl: Thanks for being here Mike. Love your background. Sandy, can you introduce yourself?

[00:02:35] Sandy Ellingson: Yes I am on the road but I am not driving. So Mark is driving and Morgan is sitting beside of me which is why I have to sit sideways. Uh but I am Sandy Ellingson. I’m an industry advocate.

 I go and advocate for my campgrounds and my campers with the industry. And to make sure that they understand how important we are and how they need to work with us and all those kinds of things. And I love it.

[00:02:59] Brian Searl: Okay, I think I figured it out. I think her camera is reversed. That’s why we thought she was driving. Okay.

 It’s a mirror image, like right? Unless you’re in Europe driving, that doesn’t make sense.

[00:03:07] Wendy Heineke: Has to be.

[00:03:09] Brian Searl: Okay, now I got it figured out. Sorry. Wendy, go ahead.

[00:03:13] Wendy Heineke: Wendy Heineke, I’m with Hospitality Across America. Thank you for having me. It’s exciting to, this is my first time. Anyways, um I actually simply put, I assist outdoor uh hospitality owners to figure out where the money’s leaking and how to fix it.

 Um I’ve got about 30 years of hospitality experience, all hands on and I’m a chameleon by design. Um everything, anything that a uh property owner or manager needs, I’m there to help them. And um I’m an RVer myself, so I I love seeing Sandy traveling right now. And I see the places where the guests want to go and that’s where I get to go.

[00:03:54] Brian Searl: Awesome. Thanks for being here Wendy. Excited to learn more about Hospitality America. You and I have crossed paths I think once or twice before, but excited to see all the new things that you’re into since then.

[00:04:02] Wendy Heineke: Yes.

[00:04:03] Brian Searl: I’m sure you guys are evolving and changing. Uh, Tyler? 

[00:04:06] Tyler Otto: Yes, Tyler Otto with Specialized Accounting. We’re outsource accounting services for the hospitality industry. So started this firm after my career uh with places like Vail Ski Resorts, Montage Hotels, um independent lodging company that didn’t do so well during the pandemic, hence why I was a free agent to start a firm. Uh yeah, 2020 wasn’t great for hotels.

 Who knew? Uh and we serve, our team of 18 serves primarily just hospitality clients across the US. A lot of hotels, marinas, campgrounds, RV resorts. That’s where we live, that’s where we specialize.

 And we have a lot of fun doing everything from the monthly accounting, tax strategy, planning, filing, advisory, and everything that comes with what you want out of an accountant. And Corben, our customer success manager is here. I mean he’s the one that talks to everyone. Corben, what did I miss?

[00:04:54] Corben Tannahill: That’s the main point. Yep. So we love working with those folks. Um if you reach out to us, I’ll be just the front guy at the gate and then pass you off to the real brains of the outfit like Tyler and the rest of our team.

[00:05:04] Brian Searl: All right, my opening question is for Tyler. Tyler, with the new big beautiful tax bill that we got from Donald Trump, how can a campground not pay any taxes?

[00:05:14] Tyler Otto: That’s always the question, right?

[00:05:14] Brian Searl: Do they need to do research and development on their property, or what needs to happen? That’s what I wanna question.

[00:05:17] Tyler Otto: Well I mean there’s there’s the easy answer. You don’t want to pay anything in taxes, don’t make a profit. Like there’s the easy answer. Solved. 

[00:05:23] Brian Searl: Slightly problematic.

[00:05:25] Tyler Otto: Yeah I know. So then beyond that it’s always the games of what are you know what are the long term goals? Because you’re not going to avoid taxes forever. It’s well when are you going to have income?

 What are you doing in the future? Do we want to take depreciation now? Like the the if people’s goal is just to mitigate taxes this year, they’re they’re forfeiting the entire strategy of what are they doing later in life and when do you really want your bracket to come down or not. And that’s a lot of the things we’re advising clients on.

 But yeah with the big one big beautiful bill uh you know the easiest things is bonus depreciation is back. So we do a lot of cost segregation studies and speeding up what we can just depreciate to get a loss on paper but money in your bank account.

[00:06:05] Brian Searl: Well and I joke about the one big beautiful bill because that’s the one thing everybody’s paid attention to. Obviously there’s lots of nuance between everything else that goes into accounting. I know it intimately well having a US company and a Canadian company and a personal LLC in the US and all kinds of other stuff that I’m operating, right? But but talk briefly like I think this is important for people to hear because we’ve heard about the narrative I think in the media from whatever network you listen to about what the big beautiful bill is, that it has massive tax deductions, things like that.

 But there’s two things in there, at least the one you were just talking about, that are really important I think for campground owners to really wrap their heads around, right?

[00:06:38] Tyler Otto: Yeah, I mean, the depreciation side is huge. With bonus depreciation back, for those of you that don’t know, you used to be limited. We still have one other tool in our pocket called Section 179, and I don’t want to put you guys to sleep, so I’m not going to go through all the specifics. But you were limited on, hey, if you, you know, bought a $20,000 RV unit to put on site, you were limited on how much you could depreciate in that year and offset against your active income.

 Bonus depreciation brought that back in a big way where you can take the benefit right now, which is super cool. Um but with that, you know, it the one big beautiful bill was touted as a lot more opportunities. And there are several things that just, you know, for the average small investor, we’re not seeing it materialize as much as well as just solid tax planning strategy in your personal life. You know, we see people doing things like S corp elections, paying their kids out of the business, doing solo 401k contributions.

 And those are still moving the needle a lot more than spending time with some of the updates in the one big beautiful bill. At least with what we’re seeing with the average small, you know, one to two property owner.

[00:07:44] Brian Searl: Is there a way to take advantage of, and maybe this is a forward thinking, you know, question that nobody’s really thinking about right now. But like for me, I’m digging into like AI and so on, taking advantage of a lot of the research and development tax credits that actually reduce my tax bill significantly. Um and so I’m curious, is there anything like that that would ever apply to campgrounds? Like can you research camper behavior?

 Can you research new amenities? Can you do any of that might apply?

[00:08:08] Tyler Otto: So there are R&D tax credits where yes, like you can say, hey, if you’re developing a new service and a new or a new tool that’s coming into the market, there are R&D tax credits you can get. Um you know, the hard part is, is the juice going to be worth the squeeze? Because if you’re just playing around, like, are you really going to go through all the work to file those extra forms and pay an accountant to get a credit, you know, but you’re going to spend a couple thousand bucks in getting the credit on paper. Is it going to offset your costs?

 And the hardest part is it can’t be, you know, labor expenses or regular expenses that you’re using for just everyday operations. So a lot of times it’s hard for people to justify, hey, I’m the owner, now part of my salary is going to this R&D. Like there’s a lot of documentation. But the thing is the R&D tax credit isn’t really new to the one big beautiful bill.

 Like they’ve been doing this, this has been around for a long while. It’s just a lot more prominent right now. Uh but I mean, you’d have to come up with something novel and if you’re going for it, like there’s a lot of hoops to jump through because we all know the IRS likes to come back and smack people with penalties and interest. That’s how they make their dough.

[00:09:16] Brian Searl: Yeah, but that’s what we have AI for to come up with novel things. Anyway, sorry. Um but so what else, what else is on your radar? Like while we finish up an accounting conversation, right?

 Like I want to talk about your business and things like that. But what else is on your radar that you think campground owners should know for 2026 to take advantage of whatever’s happening in the accounting landscape? Because it’s different, it’s different having a custom service for your, like someone who knows the industry, right?

[00:09:39] Tyler Otto: Oh absolutely. I think you know the biggest thing is running your campground and the tax benefits doesn’t happen in a vacuum. Everything in the world of taxes unless you did a roll over business startup in a C corporation and for some reason are holding your entity somewhere else in a C corp, all the taxes flow through into your personal life. And so a lot of people don’t really think about what are my long term goals?

 What am I putting away to retirement? Am I trying to self direct my investments into new properties I’m investing in? Um you know again we get back to paying kids, entity structure. You know we had one client we just brought on this last month that we found for the last 15 years under their old accountant they were paying around an extra 45,000 a year in self employment tax they didn’t need to.

 And that’s not even new to you know 2026. This is just doing the fundamentals and the basics of good entity structure as well as protecting their assets, right? Like CYA man, uh just assets instead at the end. But making sure that your entity structure doesn’t leave you open for liability or if someone wants to sue you.

 So really just looking at your tax structure and setup to optimize for savings. Um and looking at what’s going on in your personal life. Again you know I look at retirement wise, you know when do you want to start taking money? Well okay do we want to pay more taxes now at a lower rate when our business isn’t doing well because we know our retirement funds are going to be worth a lot more and we’re going to have higher taxes later?

 I think that’s the big thing is everyone and every tax advisor is so stoked to tell you save money this year, but that’s not always the best choice if it’s going to cost you more in a couple years down the line.

[00:11:15] Brian Searl: If you were Sandy’s accountant, could you deduct all of her RV travel for her? Is that a business expense?

[00:11:22] Tyler Otto: You know it’s funny. Sandy, you have a home base right? You have a separate home?

[00:11:25] Sandy Ellingson: No.

[00:11:26] Tyler Otto: No? Oh see Sandy that’s a bummer. If you can show that you have a brick and mortar home and that the RV is not your primary residence, we can actually do a lot to deduct almost all the travel, everything else saying it’s for business expenses. And we have quite a few clients we do this with.

[00:11:42] Mike Harrison: I’ve heard that you live in Arizona.

[00:11:45] Sandy Ellingson: Yeah technically I I do have a a really good CPA. My dad was a CPA so he taught me how to set myself up and how to run. So when I say no I don’t have a home base, yes I do but I am renting a space that actually is commercial. But we use it to go back and forth and as a home base.

[00:12:06] Tyler Otto: There you go.

[00:12:08] Brian Searl: You’re a little bit low Sandy. We caught everything you said but it’s just a little bit low. Just so you can if you want to move closer to the mic or something or you can turn it up in your settings. We could hear you but it was just kind of low.

 Uh so you do have a home base and we heard that you you may or may not have a home base and you may or may not be deceiving the IRS in your taxes. But we’re not going to say any of that publicly.

[00:12:28] Sandy Ellingson: No I am I am literally following all the laws but there are because of what I do and I work in all aspects of the industry, there’s some very creative ways that I can do what I need to do and still have maximum you know uh deductions. So you know because I serve on the industry side. So nine times out of ten I’m the first one to get a unit when it rolls off. So I am doing R&D.

 And so all the expenses are for R&D for that company. So it kind of works out. I have a really good way to feed my addiction.

[00:13:05] Tyler Otto: And that’s the thing, there’s strategies for everything. If you go onto TikTok, there’s going to be so many advisors that say, it’s easy, you can just claim this credit. There is always, there is always the legalese and boxes to check that you got to make sure you’re doing right or it’s going to come back to bite you. And what most people don’t get is they’re like, well, I was able to submit a tax return that had, you know, a reasonable compensation of 10,000 a year, so it must be allowed.

 I can submit whatever I want on a tax return and get it filed to the IRS. It’s if it gets audited, will it pass the audit? And if they take it to tax court, do you have a lawyer that’s willing to fight it? Not a CPA, because the CPA in tax court can’t represent you.

 You have to have a tax attorney. Do they have a defensible stance? So that’s where it’s like, some people are like, well, my, my current CPA is able to file this for me. And it’s like, well, make sure your bases are covered because I mean, I see one article a week of a firm getting indicted because of certain practices.

 So we can submit whatever we want. It’s does it pass the muster test?

[00:14:07] Brian Searl: Yeah, I think that’s- You just need to protect yourself by having like a shell campground in the Bahamas or something like that.

[00:14:12] Tyler Otto: Yeah. Yeah. That’s what works for you. 

[00:14:17] Brian Searl: I don’t know if it works. I’m I don’t want to I’m not brave enough to own a campground at all period to begin with. So uh Mike what’s going on in your world?

 Anything new that you want that you think we should talk about since we’ve been uh last together in a month? I forgot to ask that question of my current guests. Sandy you too Sandy if you got something.

[00:14:33] Mike Harrison: Uh well Sandy can go if she wants. She’s always got something new and interesting, some special data project that she can’t tell anybody about.

[00:14:42] Sandy Ellingson: Well hey listen I am actually out from under every non disclosure that I had signed right now so I can just talk all afternoon. Um but we’ve been actually on the road for two solid months. And so what what I have seen and what’s been so encouraging to me is we’ve been out in the the Northwest. And the number of campgrounds that we’ve been in that are my favorite, they’re kind of like my mom and pops, you know, they’re not all glamping.

 Their occupancy is not bad. They are doing all the right things. Their infrastructure is not falling apart. You know, it’s not the, you know, people parking in the mud.

 And so seeing this whole group of people that are, they’re totally positive and they totally don’t understand some of the language that they’re hearing out of some of the East Coast campgrounds, uh, which is kind of funny. So I really enjoyed it. And I’ve been actually validating some of the research that Scott Bahr did, uh, and took some of the things that he stated and then I look for those things when I go into campgrounds. And it’s interesting how many of the things he said were very accurate.

 Um, sadly, you know, I go into a lot of the campgrounds and I would say that 90% of the units are at least 10 years older or older. Um, which validates a lot of the conversation about people aren’t buying new rigs and it’s not about the interest rates, it’s not about gas prices, it’s about quality. Um, but, but that doesn’t mean they’re not camping, right? They’re just camping in older rigs and they’re renting rigs.

 So I am seeing a lot of Gen Zers. I’ve seen a return to tent camping. I’ve seen parks allowing car camping. I mean, all of the things that, you know, we’ve been on the circuit talking about and saying that we all need to think about new things to create these runways, right?

 I’m seeing it. I don’t see it as much on the East Coast, but boy have I seen it Midwest and West Coast.

[00:16:42] Brian Searl: Well, I think I, I think I agree with you. Like, I, I was tell- I was saying this maybe on the podcast with Scott Bahr last week on Outwired, is we were talking about how the, our industry does not have a demand problem.

There are tons and tons of people from all generations who wanna get outside and wanna enjoy nature, whether it’s outdoor recreation or camping or whatever it may be, right? I think the problem is, is that we currently, perhaps not in every facet of the economy, but we have a little bit of an affordability problem specific to maybe even RV sites that require a large entry into the market.

 But I’ve talked to a couple association owners, including one in Canada here, uh a couple days ago, maybe it was yesterday, who was telling me like they’ve they’ve convinced a couple people on like Vancouver Island to change their campground into like tent only, a lot of the sites. And maybe the margin is a little bit less, but you can make just as much money if your RV sites were only 40 to 50% full. And so this guy switched to tent sites and he has to turn people away. He’s got a waiting list now because there’s millions of people sitting in Vancouver that don’t own an RV, but will come across that ferry and go tenting.

 And then there’s all kinds of opportunities to, what do you take that, what do you take that tenting experience to the next level? How do you make it luxury? Do you have something set up to make Gen Z or somebody who hasn’t been in the outdoors much more comfortable with the outdoors? And then can you get $125, $150 a night for it?

 Bet you can. So I think it’s interesting just to think outside the box, but I don’t think we, I don’t think we have a demand problem at all, period. And yes, for sure there are down, like I’ve talked about this a lot, right? On a macro level, there are some issues with occupancy and camper nights this year. But that’s not a demand problem. I think that’s a product not matching the ability of the consumer problem. What do you think?

[00:18:19] Sandy Ellingson: I totally agree Brian and I want you to go back and slice this because the fact that you said you agreed with me and I said I agreed with you, that’s got to mean Jesus is coming back soon.

[00:18:26] Brian Searl: Maybe maybe.

[00:18:26] Sandy Ellingson: And we love each other.

[00:18:26] Brian Searl: I agree with a lot of what you say. 

[00:18:30] Sandy Ellingson: But that’s okay. 

[00:18:37] Brian Searl: I agree with a lot of what you say. Uh Mike you have anything?

[00:18:43] Mike Harrison: Um well I think you know I I find the discussion very interesting. You know I have been saying for a while obviously the change in the industry is change. And you know what it was just 10 years ago versus what it was just six years ago during COVID, which is a pivotable and forever change point in our industry, uh and now what it was two years ago, right? And and so it it’s continuously evolving, changing, you know, good and bad, but mostly for the good.

 And you know, I don’t think we necessarily have a demand problem, but I do think that demand is down. I think it’s a supply problem. You know, I think as many people have heard me say, you know, the boom of COVID, you know, basically falsely trained excited investors if you build it, they will come. And there was a, you know, glut of overbuilding and developments that happened in 21, 22, 23 that opened in 24, 25, 26.

 Unfortunately, with lack of data, there’s not a lot of good resource to track how many of these properties opened. But I can tell you in a market like, you know, uh Verde Valley in Arizona, there’s been 30% new supply over the last three years. And for a small market of, you know, 2,000, 2,500 sites of which maybe our property is 30% of the market, that’s a considerable addition. Considerable, right?

 And so it might look like demand is down, it might be demand is the same, but it is now spread, right? So you look at, you know, the metrics, you know, for individual properties, um, you know, but if you, since there’s not necessarily market metrics, it’s a little bit of false data. Um, so I I think that’s, you know, two things can be true at the same time. One can be demand is down and mostly transient, not long-term.

 Um, but I also think there’s been an oversupply. So with anything like the hotel industry, multiple cycles, we are now in a cycle. Uh, you know, I believe we have to, you know, weather the next year, year and a half as some of this transient demand, you know, rights itself, but also as the new supply absorbs, um, and stabilizes. So, uh, that’s just an answer to the general what you guys are talking about.

 You know, what’s new in CRR’s world? Um, you know, we continue to be excited with, you know, the evolution of the industry as, you know, of course you know, Brian, we continue to partner with you on new technologies and innovations and AI. Um, you know, the AI voice Rigby, which was, you know, partnered with Insider Perks, the first of its kind to be rolled out, you know, is now in, uh, is probably in high school in his level of training. He started out in nursery school.

 Um, and in another two, three months, he’ll probably graduate from college and then get his master’s. Um, you know, so he’s taking reservations, he’s learning, um, he’s absolutely helped us reduce missed call volume and help with the customer experience. Um, you know, but we continue to see, you know, what opportunities are there from a customer experience with AI, uh, and also from an efficiency standpoint. Um, again, many folks have heard me say, you know, AI does not replace hospitality, it enhances hospitality.

 And so we’re continuing to focus on, you know, how we can do that and help evolve the industry to the modern world. Um, we continue to really focus on, you know, sourcing new third-party management contracts and, and consulting engagements. We believe there’s an opportunity for us to really help provide owners, whether they’re existing management companies or independent ownership that just don’t want to do it anymore. Um, uh, but you know, we’ve been exploring in a lot of different markets.

 I just came back from Montana and spent, uh, you know, several days in Yellowstone, uh, and it’s just glorious and just reminds us why we do what we do, uh, and where we do it and how fortunate we are to do what we do, where we do it. Uh, it was just an awesome, awesome experience. Um, so, uh, that’s kind of what’s new with us. Uh, I am now a whitewater rafting expert and didn’t die, so happy to say.

[00:22:36] Wendy Heineke: Nice.

[00:22:39] Brian Searl: I don’t know if you guys can still hear me. I’m trying to fix my camera. My phone said it was overheating, so I had to turn everything off. Uh but hopefully you can hear me.

[00:22:44] Mike Harrison: That’s what you get for being outside. That would happen to me if I was outside.

[00:22:48] Brian Searl: I know, I know. I should have had a nice green office. I’m not, I can’t afford the office stuff. I don’t make enough money yet.

 I’m waiting on it. Uh well I get my camera back and figure all this stuff out. Uh Wendy, you’ve been kind of quiet because we haven’t asked you any questions up there, but what for the people who don’t know you, what is Hospitality Across America?

[00:23:07] Wendy Heineke: Well I came from the hotel industry um and I said 30 plus years in the hotel industry. And um finished my um career with a real estate investment trust and decided to retire. So I actually retired for three years and bought a rig and went on um the excursion of a lifetime going all the way across the country in a big huge coach. So I’m I’m loving Sandy what she’s doing and we we saw the goods and the bads and the uglies.

 And actually um I my first when we landed in Alabama we bought a um RV site with a casita and that was our that was our home with the RV and we just had a great time but I got bored. So I decided to call the Margaritaville guys up um that I worked with them in the hotel industry and uh started my career with uh Camp Margaritaville. And that’s pretty much how I started the career doing just doing all kinds of consulting with them, did their SOPs, did their QA um because they knew hotels but they didn’t know campgrounds. Well I really started to know campgrounds.

 Um so I helped them with their resorts that they had five at the time. So fast forward many years later and um I am pretty much as I mentioned before I’m a chameleon. 

I will do pretty much anything. Mike, Mike and I work together a lot, and Mike will call up, call me up and say, “Hey, I need some revenue management support. Can you work for a couple of months and do some revenue management? Can you do HR?” Um, “Hey, can you look at our operations efficiency?” So really what I do is, is I will go in and I’m, I’m very boutique because I want the long-term with my clients.

So like I work for Mike and then for a month and then I disappear for about three months and then he calls me up again. So really mine is a long term and I’ll I’ll work with like right now I’m working with a city park in Texas. And small park um I’m not a I’m not a huge expensive consultant and I’m just charging them on an hourly basis and just helping them um get through some of their efficiencies, some social media, some marketing, um teaching them what AI is, but it’s the city so it’s you know you got to be careful with what they do.

 So um then you know I’m working with a RV a large RV resort here in Alabama and it’s a very different. So I’m working all the revenue management, I’m doing Campspot which thank God with Mike because I learned everything I needed to do with Campspot through Mike. Um so I’m I’m actually now working with Campspot and they’re sending me to clients that need extra support. So again I’m a chameleon.

 Um you know I was a GM in in the hotel industry. I have run campgrounds, I have run hotels, I’ve done revenue management. So whatever the client needs I’ll work with them to see if I can help them. But I will never say hey uh you’re um you know I can’t work for you or I can work with you.

 It really just depends on what they need. Um and it’s really interesting Sandy was talking about the tents. I was just up in Wisconsin visiting some campgrounds and one there was like seven days and it was a little city park up in Wisconsin and seven days they were full and it was Fourth of July weekend with tents. They had 60 sites and 37 of them were tents.

 And cars, and I was surprised about the cars, but now I’m glad to hear from you guys on that because I couldn’t believe how many cars were, like six or seven cars that people just sleeping in.

[00:26:49] Mike Harrison: Oh my gosh, don’t don’t get Sandy going on car camping. We’ll be here for like four hours.

[00:26:54] Wendy Heineke: I loved it. Um and it’s revenue.

[00:26:59] Mike Harrison: Yeah. You know I’d like to just advocate for the folks on this call. You know as Sandy meant or I’m sorry Wendy mentioned she’s a chameleon. I actually call her a Swiss Army knife, right?

 She’s got a lot of different functions that she could do. Um and as I look at the call, I mean I haven’t had a chance yet to work with Specialized Accounting, but I think I’ve paid everybody on this call, but nobody has paid me. Like like Brian where I need someone to pay me. Um but I think you know it’s interesting.

[00:27:28] Brian Searl: What are you talking about? You’ve been paid in revenue management advice. You’ve been paid in everything. You’ve been paid in marketing. You’ve been paid in…

[00:27:36] Mike Harrison: I need a violin. Um but you know what I think is really true, you know Wendy had mentioned about the little property. What I think kind of you know is indicative of especially of Sandy and Brian and and Wendy and I don’t mean to leave you know Specialized guys out but you know service. I I think you know even if you don’t get paid, you know Wendy, Sandy, Brian, you guys can’t help yourself but helping people, right?

 And like you said you unretired. And I I just think that’s a hallmark of what we do. And you know the folks on this call just a shout out to those that are listening, you know we’ve got some tremendous advocates for our industry and leaders in our industry that are that are right here. For folks that sometimes will not even take a penny or refuse to take a penny because they just want to help and they’ll answer a question or they’ll provide you a link or they’ll give you a resource.

 And so I I think that’s a message for us as we you know go forward in this industry. And why I love it so much, it’s a little bit different than the hospitality industry. It’s just the advocacy and the partnership of you know rising tide raises all ships. Even though we have competitors like like you know Roff is a competitor for us at Blue Water but yeah we talk regularly and and help each other.

 And it’s just an important component of what we do. So that’s just a little bit of an esoteric soliloquy if you will um but I think that’s important for us to know. And good job for you guys.

[00:28:55] Brian Searl: As much as that was beautiful, I want to go back to car camping for a second.

[00:28:59] Mike Harrison: No.

[00:28:59] Brian Searl: No, no, no, let me explain because I don’t want to get into the whole long conversation with Sandy about it, right? Uh but what I want to what interests me though is just the original conversation that we had about Mike you’re saying there’s not a demand issue. I don’t necessarily disagree with you. I question whether the demand is, no that’s wrong because I don’t think there’s a demand issue at all.

 Either whether it’s an RV or in tent or in glamping or whatever, I think it’s an affordability issue. Can I afford to put gas in the rig? Can I afford to go a thousand miles versus 200 and staying closer to my home? Can I afford the premium full hookup site or can I afford to stay at a state park instead this year?

[00:29:38] Mike Harrison: That still translates to demand though Brian. I understand what you’re saying. It doesn’t mean that there’s not a desire, right? You know I desire to go to Europe this year, but I also desire to go on more trips this year, right?

[00:29:49] Brian Searl: And that’s what I’m equating demand with, to be clear. It’s desire. I’m speaking about it right now on this podcast, I’m saying demand is desire. 

[00:29:55] Mike Harrison: There’s a difference. That’s intent, right? And intent does not necessarily mean demand. I mean you can intend to do something all day long, but you know unless you put that in the bank, it doesn’t translate to demand. So I hear you.

 I don’t disagree that there’s an affordability issue and as all the KOA statistics have shown, frequency is down, right? Um and that’s obviously directly dependent upon market. Um, but, but I … They’re, they’re different. Go ahead. I’m sorry. 

[00:30:20] Brian Searl: No, no, no. I agree with you, but that’s only part one, right?

So then part two is, is if there is still demand, like not desire, but there is still … If your desire is to stay in the full hookup pull-through, but, or just to go camping, then you still have, you’re still demanding a site. You’re just not demanding the same type of site or accommodation that you were before.

So is there a point where, just like this campground that converted in Vancouver Island, or the one that Wendy said was full of tents and full of car camping, is there a point in time where owners step back and look at, okay, well, demand- Demand, desire, whatever you wanna call it, right? Both, in some cases, uh, has changed or is down or is up or has fluctuated or spread out into new inventory or whatever it is, right?

Is there a way that I can meet that demand/desire by offering a differentiated kind of product at my property?

[00:31:10] Mike Harrison: It’s a good question, but I would be careful if I’m extrapolating what you’re saying is, are you downgrading to make it more affordable, and does that mean that you still have demand? But I would be careful with that because the numbers don’t say that.

In both the hotel industry and the camping industry, if you look at CoStar’s report in the hotel industry, hotel industry is also struggling except in the luxury segment. Luxury segment is up. All of the numbers when on the data dicks say the exact same thing, right? The luxury properties, the larger full-service properties are performing and outperforming the smaller ones with a lower ADR.

So while I understand what you’re saying is maybe there’s an opportunity to say that there’s desire, so instead of taking, spending the $100 on the large site, they’ll spend 50. I, I don’t think that’s– the numbers don’t say that that’s true. Um- All right 

[00:31:58] Wendy Heineke: So, so Mike, I have a question though, because you’ve got, you’ve got RV resorts, you’ve got campgrounds, you know, then you’ve got glamping, right?

So, so RV resorts, yes, that’s a luxury in our world, in the hotel world. But then you also have campgrounds where they have sites that they can say, you know, that I c- I will accept more tents and put more tents in inventory, tent sites in inventory to sell those tent sites. I don’t think, like, uh, y- like your resorts are spectacular.

They’re gorgeous- 

[00:32:32] Mike Harrison: I’m not just saying my properties as- 

[00:32:34] Wendy Heineke: Yeah. But, yeah, look at

[00:32:35] Mike Harrison: ca- I’m not talking about, I’m not talking about my properties. I’m talking about the industry. Yeah. Again, KOA, which has a diversity of sites, including tents, is not saying that the, the tent market is up, right? And so I, I think it’s gotta be some data digging.

[00:32:50] Wendy Heineke: But that’s… Yes, it does, ’cause that’s… 

[00:32:52] Sandy Ellingson: Well, 

[00:32:53] Wendy Heineke: go ahead, Sandy. Go ahead. 

[00:32:54] Sandy Ellingson: Well I was going to say I think you’re all right. And what’s interesting is it’s not about everything being a tent or everything not being a tent. What what research has shown us and we’ve now just started a new thing where we’re actually working with statisticians to calculate out where the industry is going to be based on current statistics. And one of the things that it identified is that over the last 10 years we’ve lost the onboarding process.

 And tent camping, that’s what it was. I always called it the gateway drug, right? Young people couldn’t afford to buy an RV, would get a tent and they’d start out camping in their backyard. And then they moved up to hey I’m going to camp in a campground.

 And then they moved up to oh my gosh look at the rain and that guy over there, I want one of those. So tents were the best sales tool the RV industry ever had. But somehow we managed to close them out and come up with this idea that we couldn’t have tent campers in our campgrounds anymore because we were an RV park. And so what we’re seeing is we’ve got to find more onboarding processes for younger people.

 So we don’t want to offer necessarily all of our sites, but we do need to have a certain percentage of them to start bringing these younger people in who can’t afford the RV yet. Otherwise we’re going to end up running out of runway.

[00:34:23] Brian Searl: Yeah I agree with that. I think I think we’re both like Sandy said I think we’re all right. And I think that’s part of the reason that it’s so hard to diagnose. You’re right Mike there is a K shaped economy.

 The luxury people are still spending. There’s no question about that. At the same time there seems to be a small increase in demand in regular let’s call it regular traditional tent camping. But I think there’s also a market for the luxury tent camping market.

 Like the thoughtfully curated kind of state park clone that like Jeremy Johnson has done way better up in Michigan, right? I think there’s opportunities for like I think we’ve been so focused for the last 40 to 60 years and I’m speaking on a macro level, there are certainly people who do this well and there are exceptions to what I’m about to say. But we’ve been focused on like what Sandy said, making an RV park only for RVs and hanging the entire hat of the industry on the RV industry period. And I think if we do that, I’m not saying go away from RVs, but if we do that and we also diversify with rentals and glamping and maybe tent camping, but maybe a more of a luxury product if you need to do that at a place like Verde Ranch or something like that, right?

 Maybe you can just put some more different type of thought into the process, then there’s opportunities to expand your revenue. I want to give that back to Wendy to tackle that. And then Tyler I want to hear your thoughts from the accounting aspect.

[00:35:38] Wendy Heineke: Well it’s really interesting. I did a blog a couple weeks ago on RV bookings are soft. No doubt about it. But your glamping is not.

 So I’ve got four clients that are just glamping um and luxury um glamping resorts. And one’s up in Charlemont, Massachusetts and they are doing, they just opened in October and they’re running 80% occupancy and they’re running a $400 rate. And you know why? Because they’re pulling it from Boston.

 They’re pulling it from New York. And so you do have the luxury side, but glamping is not down as much. Yeah of course a little bit, but people still want to spend that money and go for a two night or three night stay.

[00:36:25] Mike Harrison: Glamping is not down at all. Glamping continues to be up double digits.

[00:36:29] Wendy Heineke: So the question is when you look at the RV side, do you put those tents in? Like Verde is a perfect example of a glamping, it’s an RV resort but it’s also glamping. And do you you know does the industry start focusing a little bit more, cabins yeah, but you know the safari tents, the you know the tents, the and even smaller tents. And one of the things I was recommending to the city park that I was doing is buy some tents and rent them out.

 You know because you know and that’s a big thing is that again we’re trying to just get heads in beds or heads in sites and let’s get you know be able to rent the tents out for $30 and the site for $10, you know again they’re a lower cost and that may be the way that some of us do it. You know we just got to be creative.

[00:37:25] Brian Searl: Sure but it doesn’t always have to be a downgrade too is what I’m saying, right? Right. Let’s just we’re going to pick on Verde for example, right? And you know the revenue way better than I ever do Wendy and Mike you guys have worked on all that stuff, right?

 But so nobody’s I think nobody’s arguing that like Mike you should rent tent sites for $30 at Verde Ranch or Verde River. 

[00:37:43] Wendy Heineke: Right. 

[00:37:44] Brian Searl: But perhaps perhaps there is a space for a luxury curated tent that you like maybe you buy like 15, 20 of these, you set them all up, they’re really nice tents, you curate the site, you landscape it, you have it all ready to go with sleeping bags, whatever else. And then you sell that product for $125, $150. That’s luxury to the luxury person who’s in Phoenix or in Sedona or in somewhere else who wants to see something different, then that doesn’t take away the aesthetic of your site.

 It makes it still high end and it gives you something to fill while the RV sites are temporarily down because of supply or whatever else, right?

[00:38:19] Mike Harrison: Define luxury tent. Now is that like a Coleman instant tent that’s nice or is it one of the ones like a safari tent, etc.?

[00:38:27] Brian Searl: I think it depends on you and your resort. Like it could be different either way. I think you can make a really nice Coleman tent look really good on a site if you set it up well.

[00:38:37] Mike Harrison: So and I think look I the goal is not to poo poo what you’re saying. I completely agree with your idea about glamping. Tenting is a very different experience. Tenting without a bathroom, without electric, without facilities, you know just kind of roughing it um is a very very different experience.

 Um but what you’re describing is again more in the glamping world which isn’t down and people continue to do and I recommend that to every property that we discuss. Um because people do want to do that. They do want to experience it, but they want to experience glamping, not necessarily tenting. Tenting is its own world which is a great a great world and we’ve had that you know experience at a couple of our properties.

 Um but it’s a very different um experience. I’m not saying that that couldn’t work if you curated a tent site that isn’t glamping, but I think you’d have a hard time attracting the customer that’s looking for a you know a glamping experience.

[00:39:32] Brian Searl: Well I agree with you, but I think there’s a whole another world of people who aren’t exposed to glamping or don’t have $200 or $300 a night to spend on glamping that like you can buy, I’m not talking about a $30 Coleman tent. You can buy a really nice $300, $400 Nemo tent that are like really well designed and ventilated and curated. And yes it’s a different type of audience like you’re talking about, but it’s an audience. And if your occupancy is down, I’m not saying yours is, I’m just saying generally macro in the industry, right?

 Then maybe that’s something you can look at, just different types of ideas to figure that stuff out. What do you think of the numbers Tyler? Do the numbers add up? Can somebody can somebody…

[00:40:14] Tyler Otto: I mean I’m happy to weigh in as the nerd. I mean because here’s the hard part is like all the rest of you guys, you’re in you’re involved at the guest level of curating that experience where we’re we’re after the fact. We’re picking up the pieces seeing what came out on the other end. Now what I will say is you know like accounting is a service so maybe it is we are skewed because we see people that are charging higher rates and can afford to outsource services whether it’s social media, accounting, operations.

 Usually you have a higher average daily rate to be able to support that. So my data set might be skewed in that alone. Knowing that, we are seeing a lot of people that you know they’ve had the traditional campsites but they’re trying to set themselves apart whether it’s glamping, cabins, RV resorts, they’re trying to set themselves apart and get more customers in by adding more amenities whether it’s stand up paddle boarding or you know some sort of bar component you know drinks around the campfire with a cash bar. But like as you add those more amenities there’s usually a staff component.

 And if we start looking at the to use a hospitality term even though it doesn’t apply to tents, cost per occupied room, you do not see the returns by getting more tent sites at $30 a night especially because those people at $30 a night seeing those amenities, they want parts of it. And unless you’re truly generating cash, usually a lot of our owners are seeing a lot more benefits of picking sites and upgrading them to either support you know full hookup RV or start putting in you know the geodesic domes, putting in the safari tents, the teepees with you know bedding and heated and all that wonderful. Like we see a lot more of that shift right now for our clients that are continuing to be very successful. And as they upgrade and upskill um we’re seeing their occupancy either stay flat or grow but the ADR is definitely increasing.

[00:42:08] Brian Searl: Makes sense. Corben, you’ve been quiet. Like you can talk too at the same time. Like I just am defaulting to asking Tyler questions, sorry. 

Anything to add Corben?

[00:42:19] Corben Tannahill: Yeah for me it’s just been really exciting to see folks that we’ve been working with. You all see the decisions they’re making, but like Tyler said we see what comes out of it. And so when they’re able to outsource something whether it’s you know a marketing piece to you all or other different components, we see that they get their lives back and they get to go spend time with their kids, their grandkids. And I assume you guys see that as well with the different owners, when they get their life back, it’s so so exciting to help them out in that way.

 So that’s been neat for me to see in the industry. I agree. I think a lot of folks are transitioning to new seasons and so getting to see it’s been neat.

[00:42:55] Brian Searl: Anybody else have anything to add on that topic? Do we have any general, I don’t know how we, as always every week, I don’t know how we end down the rabbit holes that we do. It’s quite interesting sometimes, but here we go. 

 I am curious though Mike, is there ever a world where you add luxury tenting to Verde or consider it?

[00:43:12] Mike Harrison: Well again when you say luxury tenting, we already have luxury tenting there. You know we have glamping tents and covered wagons. And that’s why I was saying is a clear definition of when you say luxury, what does that mean? Um, uh, you know, luxury tenting, like what I think what you were describing is like what you said, a $300 or $400 tent.

 That is not a glamping experience if there aren’t facilities, you know power, water, um um facilities in the tent. Um, and so maybe, you, you know, it’s typically not, you know, the customer in our properties. Um, and you know, the campground isn’t necessarily set up for that. Um, but you know, we’re in that mode now of exploring every type of revenue opportunity.

So, you know, it’s certainly something we could look at. 

[00:43:58] Brian Searl: Yeah I mean I’m talking about like you’re right. Like I’m talking about whatever that middle market is between glamping and the ability to afford an RV and like basic tenting. I think there’s a mid market there that there’s a whole lot of people around a whole lot of properties in the United States that I’m not saying that’s the answer for everybody. I’m saying that’s one thing out of dozens that Wendy could consult on or Sandy could consult on, right?

 Or or you could consult on Mike from a third party management perspective that just are options for you to be flexible in whatever today’s world is, whether that continues next year, gets worse, gets better, whatever we’re in. It’s always good to be flexible. Sandy, you unmuted. You got something?

[00:44:36] Sandy Ellingson: Well I think it’s all about first of all being true to your brand. And so for Mike to go to some of his parks and put in tents would kill the brand. It doesn’t match, right? When I’m talking about just true tenting.

 At the same time as an industry as a whole, we need parks who are allowing tent campers because we need that onboarding of younger people who can’t afford to come in, but we want them to come in and fall in love with camping. One of the things I advise, you know retail has always had what they call the loss leader. And I will go into Sam’s or Costco all day long to get the $5 chicken. Now they are losing money on that $5 chicken, but when I go in there I’m also buying a whole lot of other things.

 So it really is about being not just putting up a tent site, but being strategic like Tyler was saying and what else can we engage them to do? Because maybe in their tent, which makes them more apt to rent the kayak and rent the boat or go to have a beer around the cocktail bar, right? They couldn’t do that in an RV, but they can do it in a tent. And the other thing too is we just left a park and the guy was there in a Tesla and his tent setup cost him $30,000.

 And it literally was a tent. Okay. So this isn’t just something we’re talking about that you know poor people need, right? Or young people need.

 These are all there’s so many variations of it that I think Mike what you’re saying is you can’t you can’t put a blanket coverage on it either.

[00:46:12] Brian Searl: I want I want to have Wendy weigh in on ancillary revenue in a second because I think you’re right. Like I remember looking at like grocery prices, totally unrelated, right? Like a week and a half ago, there was an article about how Walmart was lowering prices, but they were lowering prices on like 10 specific goods, like beef or something to get people in the door to save on the beef. And what would end up happening is they would spend 40 bucks more than they would have with the higher expensive beef because they would come into the store to get the beef and then fill up their carts with everything else.

 So to your point about ancillary revenue, it’s an excellent one. Mike, you sounded like you had something to say.

[00:46:47] Mike Harrison: Yeah well I think you know I was going to comment you know Sandy had used the term loss leader and I think that’s a great way to put it. It’s you know we’re doing the same things of trying to attract people to our campgrounds and resorts of you know whether it is you throw in a golf cart for free you know or you know what are the different ideas and promotions you know so that you attract and bring people in so that there’s any kind of spend. And then my second part was going to be you had said it about flexibility. I’ll just re term that to versatility.

 I think you know how do you explore alternative revenue sources for your property that you haven’t done before? Like you know for initially you know we had didn’t you know we didn’t accept you know like uh rooftop tents or camper vans um you know six years ago, right? A little bit elitist if you will. Um but yeah we adapted over the years as we understood you know how the industry has changed and that the industry did change and what those camper vans have become and you know some of those other you know experiences.

 So I think versatility and being able to you know be a Swiss Army knife in your property and and try different things is is super important. So I I think you know what you said is is absolutely true Brian.

[00:47:55] Brian Searl: But also you don’t want to be the Swiss Army knife to be clear. That’s Wendy.

[00:47:58] Wendy Heineke: Yes. 

[00:47:59] Mike Harrison: There’s only one Swiss Army knife, yes.

[00:48:01] Wendy Heineke: Yes it is. 

[00:48:03] Mike Harrison: She’s a Coleman.

[00:48:07] Brian Searl: What do you think of the ancillary revenue loss leader stuff Wendy from a revenue management perspective?

[00:48:11] Wendy Heineke: Well yeah no it’s it’s really important. What I’ve seen with a lot of the resorts out there and campgrounds um and as I said I work a lot with um Campspot, the add ons is so important to to have for the ancillary revenue. So you know selling the firewood, selling the golf carts, everything when you’re making a reservation to be able to show what is out there that you have and that you offer. Um and Mike’s team has been fantastic in trying to create and Verde is a perfect example, we keep going back to that, but create also experiences.

 So they have you know add ons that will create experiences. So there’s there’s one and like I think it’s a whitewater rafting, but I can go in, I don’t buy it, but I can see that I can find out about it. And that will help me you know when I go and check out, I may not abandon my cart. I’m like oh wow they offer this kind of stuff.

 I want to find out more about it. And so it gives them more and that’s bringing the experiences into the customer. So it’s not just about the add ons, but the experiences. The food, you know we do a lot of like food trucks.

 And if we don’t have food and beverage in our campground or resort, we partner with food trucks and bringing events in. And you know that’s what will help bring that revenue in, that ancillary revenue in.

[00:49:38] Tyler Otto: Honestly that’s true of all of our best clients is they’ve got something else besides the heads in beds or you know campgrounds or tents on site that is driving the revenue. It’s a killer F&B operation, you know one of our clients they just have a boat dock on a major river and they’re a campground there but man they print money at the bar at this you know restaurant on the water. Or you know they’re a huge wedding venue site and they chose a route to get rid of the tents but make it really easy for people to get trailers and other stuff in to do weddings. And so it’s like finding that ancillary that your your hospitality, your lodging side facilitates your real revenue generating business.

 And I don’t think there’s a standard playbook. It’s your location, it’s your site, it’s what you can uniquely do. If you’re on a river in a party town then absolutely run with it. That won’t work for you probably on some small lake in Minnesota.

 So you know definitely finding what is that going to be that ancillary that really sets you apart. Our best clients seem to always have that.

[00:50:37] Brian Searl: Wait, are you saying people on a lake in Minnesota don’t like to have fun? Is that what you’re saying?

[00:50:40] Tyler Otto: I’m saying there’s probably is not as many transients.

[00:50:45] Brian Searl: You gotta bring them there. You gotta build the resort and they will come.

[00:50:48] Tyler Otto: Yeah you know if you’re on a river people will just boat up for an hour to come drink and float down, you know you’re confined to that that little lake in Minnesota.

[00:50:57] Brian Searl: Fair. True. 

Uh let’s spend the last 10 minutes, let’s ask each other some questions here and see what uh anybody else wants to think of each other. Tyler what we normally do is we’ll go around uh we’ll just ask like do you have a question for Wendy or Sandy or Mike or I don’t know I feel like you could ask it to Corben if you really want to but maybe you guys talk to each other more regularly.

 Do you have a question that you’d like answered from either of those three people?

[00:51:21] Tyler Otto: I mean I would love to ask Wendy just because you and I have the similar background. We started in hospitality and then how it translates here. And I’m curious like before you got into this, I assume you did not realize how many crossovers there are from luxury hotels all of a sudden into campgrounds and RVs. What do you feel like the average owner doesn’t realize they could steal knowledge, resource, best practice wise from traditional hotel hospitality that really translates into glamping and RV resorts?

[00:51:49] Wendy Heineke: Um hiring. Believe it or not. Hiring hospitality instinct. Um a lot of people will hire for technical and not hire for that hospitality.

 And you know this is a big issue in this industry right now is oh my god I can’t find the right people. I can’t you know I can’t hire the right people. You know look in the right spot. You know I go back to Mike because I love Mike but he hires people from the hotel industry.

 And his GMs are from the hotel industry. That’s what people are missing is that you got to hire for that hospitable because we have that personality. We love that hospitality feel. And we get it.

 But in you know the the moms and pops out there are awesome. They’re they that’s what they want to do but they’ve never been in it before. So they they don’t understand how to hire into that hospitality.

[00:52:47] Tyler Otto: I like it. That’s what I got.

[00:52:50] Brian Searl: All right Wendy your turn. Got a question?

[00:52:54] Wendy Heineke: Sandy. So when you go into a property, tell me what you do. Because I’m so I’d love to hear what you do.

[00:53:02] Mike Harrison: Gosh, let me get comfortable. 

[00:53:04] Sandy Ellingson: My background is technology so I see everything through the lens of technology. But my heart is an RVer. So I go in and look at it like I’m an RVer, but from a business standpoint, I look at where are they losing in that they’re not embracing technology the right way. I spent a lot of time working with nonprofits and the thing with the nonprofits was they were oversold technology and then under trained on how to use it.

 And that is so often uh you know in the in the campground industry, especially when you look at, it doesn’t matter if you’re looking at a big one or a small one or a big group, they flip property management softwares fast as I change clothes. Uh because no one is ever giving them exactly what they want. And that is such a waste of time and energy and every time they change, they lose data. 

So anyway, it’s just, uh, I like to go in and help them learn how to do it right and to step into the technology. Uh, and then also I, I’m a geek, I’m a total data geek, and so I want to see what the data is telling them, not what they think, but what… I feel like the truth is that the data alway

[00:54:22] Wendy Heineke: Brilliant. I love it.

[00:54:23] Brian Searl: All right Sandy you got a question?

[00:54:26] Sandy Ellingson: Uh yes. Okay Tyler, controversial. 

[00:54:30] Tyler Otto: Hit me. 

[00:54:31] Sandy Ellingson: I want to know of all the different property management softwares that you work with, we’re looking with clients, which one is the easiest to get a monthly uh true ledger from?

[00:54:47] Tyler Otto: Oh man, this is such a loaded question because I so first of all like six or seven of the players in the space, I actually worked with them to build their QuickBooks integration. So like I know the back ends and I know their issues. Um 

[00:55:01] Brian Searl: Which makes the answer even more interesting, doesn’t it? Yeah have you already casted for all six here? Just make sure.

[00:55:07] Sandy Ellingson: First company that Intuit allowed to write an SDK into their software. So I go way back to when they bought it 

[00:55:18] Tyler Otto: Okay, okay. I mean the cleanest journal entries and the reason I want to give them the award is because not only are the journal entries clean, they reconcile and everything’s perfect, but they have a good night audit function that locks out prior periods so your employees can’t go change historical numbers that don’t sync over. I’m going to give the award to ThinkReservations.

 There’s a lot of other good ones out there. And you know their back end side is not nearly wow that’s going to sound bad but their back end user is not as sexy looking as some other softwares. But the accounting always reconciles, always checks out and you never have a guest ledger advanced deposit, city ledger that all of a sudden doesn’t tie out. We’ve never had an issue on a single one of their you know the 20 accounts we work with that use Think.

 So I’m going to give them the award. A lot of other people do good stuff as well, but they all have at least one or two minor bugs that I could point out.

[00:56:13] Brian Searl: I don’t know if I’ve heard of ThinkReservations. Have you?

[00:56:14] Wendy Heineke: I haven’t. No. 

[00:56:17] Brian Searl: Are they in campgrounds?

[00:56:18] Tyler Otto: They’re they’re still relatively new and they do a lot more in the smaller end boutique hotels, but we’ve seen several glamp grounds starting to use them, you know but it’s our glamping clients that are doing three, $400 a night ADR. Other than that like ResNexus always ties out. They just don’t understand how to do house Airbnb accounts and you have to do a little workaround to close them out, otherwise you have this perpetually growing weirdness. Um you know I mean everyone’s got their quirks.

[00:56:46] Sandy Ellingson: And I do think one of the things you said is that they have a night audit function closing things out so you can’t go back and edit it. Because nine times out of ten when I have to go to war with one of my friends out to property management software for a campground, it’s the fact that it’s not locked down and as soon as you figure out what caused the change, it’s all a switch.

[00:57:08] Tyler Otto: Yep. And there’s other softwares where they have a night audit function, but it doesn’t permanently lock anything out like in ROAD or you know ResNexus you used to have that issue. Um you know Campspot it still has that issue. So that’s where I just if everything always ties out for me, ThinkReservations gets the award.

[00:57:28] Brian Searl: All right. Mike, you have any questions?

[00:57:29] Mike Harrison: I don’t.

[00:57:33] Brian Searl: Okay. You don’t?

[00:57:34] Mike Harrison: Nope, mainly because I have to hop off in like 30 seconds.

[00:57:38] Brian Searl: Well you could have just asked a question and left us all hanging. Like ask a really hard question. But okay, all right. I think that’s a pretty good discussion.

 Like I think we talked uh I think we had a pretty good conversation about the differences and nuances and how to adapt and be adaptable and uh or flexible or whatever you know we want to call it. Uh but just look at your I think it goes back to the same thing that we’ve that we talked about on the show many times before with many different guests is you need to understand your property. You need to do you know in the beginning or even if you’ve never done it before, feasibility studies, understand your market, understand your niche, understand your audience. Who’s coming to you?

 Who are you nearby? Uh why are they coming? How long are they staying? And then and then regularly like does that change?

 Because I think for some people that’s changed in 2026. I think the economy has made it change. Now whether that reverses back in 2027, nobody knows yet, right? Whether the temporary lowering of gas prices, which are about to go up in a couple days again, uh um is is a is a thing that’s driving behavior, we don’t know yet.

 Scott Bahr seems to think lower gas prices help our industry up to a certain point and the data is there that shows that too. But I think the point is just understand your audience as deeply as you can, look at your numbers as deeply as you can, hire a Swiss Army knife if you need to, if he’s available. Uh you know have a good accountant, have good teams, right? Whether it’s internal, external, whatever else.

 Obviously talk to Corben too, he’s been quiet. Uh and and just overall just be ready to pivot, move, and adapt because this industry and the world kind of is seemingly changing a little bit faster than it ever has in the history of let’s call it camping or really the world before. Uh and so if you’re prepared for that by understanding who you have and where you can go and how you can move, then I think you’re all the better off for it. So final thoughts Tyler, where can they find out uh final thoughts about the show and then where can they find out more about your accounting firm?

[00:59:34] Tyler Otto: Uh sure. Final thoughts about the show. Um know what you want to do for the next five years, whether you’re going to sell, whether you’re going to own, whether you want to mitigate taxes or you plan to grow, because making a single financial accounting tax decision just with this year in mind is a really bad idea. So know what you want to do, have that laid out.

 If you guys want to connect with us more, want to talk to uh me or you know the handsome man down below, Corben, uh just reach out to hello@specializedat.com. We’re Specialized Accounting. You can find us online and yeah, we love nerding out on hotels and campgrounds, so hit us up.

[01:00:09] Brian Searl: Thanks for being here Tyler. Corben, same to you. Final thoughts?

[01:00:12] Corben Tannahill: Likewise. Yeah, excited to meet you guys.

[01:00:15] Brian Searl: Thanks for being here. I appreciate you Corben. Sorry we didn’t get to talk to you too much. It’s I’m not used to having two people from the same place.

 Wendy, final thoughts and where can they find out more about Hospitality America, Across America?

[01:00:25] Wendy Heineke: This is great. Thank you. I think it’s um I love the the banter. This is my first time on here and I love the banter back and forth.

 Um you know Mike always makes it usually fun. But uh you can find me at hospitalityacrossamerica.com or um hospitalityacrossamerica@gmail.com. We’re also on LinkedIn. So I do a lot on LinkedIn.

 Uh do a lot of blogs and post every other week. So uh usually where I’m most active.

[01:00:52] Brian Searl: Awesome. Well thank you all for being here. I appreciate it. We don’t have another Outwired show today, so you guys won’t be able to see more of me and Scott Bahr.

 We’re taking the week off. Uh but we’ll see you next week on another episode of MC Fireside Chats. Thanks for being here guys. See ya.

[01:01:04] Wendy Heineke: Thank you.