MC Fireside Chats – January 28th, 2026

[00:00:45] Brian Searl: It’s Brian Searl with Insider Perks and Modern Campground. I’m just looking at my camera here, like straight in front of me, and it looks like it’s pointed up and that way.

But it looks straight when I look at myself on the camera, so I don’t know what’s happening. Could just be drunk off my kombucha.

Welcome everybody to another episode. Appreciate all our recurring guests being here. Matt and Mychele and Kurtis, and we have Sandrine. Is it Sandrine or Sandrine?

[00:01:09] Sandrine Zechbauer: Sandrine. That’s right.

[00:01:11] Brian Searl: Sandrine. Okay, I got it right the first time. So Sandrine joining us from the United Kingdom as well from RMS. Excited to have a good conversation here about all things technology, AI, and everything else that we do on this week with these guests.

But let me start by having us go around the room and just let everybody introduce themselves briefly. Matt, you want to start?

[00:01:29] Matt Whitermore: Yes, sir. Thank you, Brian. Happy to see everybody here today. I’m Matt Whitermore. I am Director of Market Expansion at Unhitched Management and Climb Capital.

We are up to 32 parks now. Nearly 3,500 campsites stretching across the country now. Had historically had a focus in the Southeast, but we just acquired a portfolio that now stretches us up into the Midwest. We’re now in Texas. We’re now in Georgia.

A few new states. So we’ve been busy onboarding all those properties and it’s been it’s been a fun but hectic, but awesome few months at Climb and Unhitched.

[00:02:09] Brian Searl: Awesome. Excited to see you guys continue to grow. Mychele?

[00:02:11] Mychele Bisson: I’m Mychele Bisson. I’m the CEO of Bisson Peak Ventures and Wave Haven Resorts. We are finishing closing out our 10th park actually and our fourth marina.

We own parks from Alaska down to Florida. And I am slowly trying to get to the level of Matt’s company. My gosh.

[00:02:34] Brian Searl: Did you feel like when you started you were just like, I don’t want to do it differently than everybody else. I want to start at the farthest possible locations I can from each other. Alaska and Florida, so I can travel more long distances.

[00:02:44] Mychele Bisson: It works out. It works out.

[00:02:45] Brian Searl: Or you were just like, I love Florida, I want to go visit there, and I love Alaska, I want to go visit there. That’s where I’m gonna buy parks.

[00:02:50] Mychele Bisson: Yeah, no, I did. I actually, when we purchased Alaska, it was mainly because I wanted to visit Alaska and I just fell in love with it. 

[00:02:56] Brian Searl: Makes sense. You need one in Hawaii then.

[00:02:57] Mychele Bisson: Right? Yes. That would be awesome. Or maybe the UK as we talk to Sandrine later.

[00:03:03] Brian Searl: That works. Kurtis.

[00:03:06] Kurtis Wilkins: Hey, I’m Kurtis Wilkins with Our Journey and Advanced Outdoor Management. We have locations all across the US, the continental US. I think we’re hanging around with branded locations at 45 and unbranded around 12 to 15.

And yeah. That’s where we’re at right now.

[00:03:24] Brian Searl: Awesome.

[00:03:24] Kurtis Wilkins: Always looking for new clients as well. We’ve signed quite a few this winter.

[00:03:29] Brian Searl: Awesome. Congratulations. Sandrine. Last but not least.

[00:03:33] Sandrine Zechbauer: Nice to meet you all. I’m Sandrine Zechbauer. I am the Chief Marketing Officer at RMS. RMS is a PMS. It is actually quite confusing, but there we are. Property management system or reservation management system for parks.

You might know us, we originate from Australia where we’ve been for many years. As long as I’ve been born, so that tells you, I won’t tell you how long that is, but it’s a while.

And we are quite strong in the US with many parks who, I was going to say to our name, it’s not quite that, but that have chosen RMS to power their operation. So delighted to join you.

You will hear from my accent that I am not American. I am French, but I live in the UK. I realized I should probably have sent my US colleague for better US representation. But anyway, it feels like it’s a good group of friends here, so delighted to join you guys.

[00:04:19] Brian Searl: There is nothing wrong with we have people from all over the world on the podcast all the time and I’m in Calgary, Canada, so at least there’s three countries here now.

[00:04:31] Sandrine Zechbauer: Exactly.

[00:04:32] Brian Searl: Yeah. So let’s do this first before, cause I have some interesting things I want to talk about related to AI when we were having a brief little conversation before.

But to, to our recurring guests, Matt, Mychele, Kurtis, is there anything that is on your agenda or that you’ve come across your desk in the last month since we’ve been together that you think we should be talking about? Related to obviously our show topic of AI, technology, stuff like that.

[00:04:54] Matt Whitermore: I think so. I think so. I’ll jump in because AI has been personally and professionally what’s largely been on my plate for the last few months.

And I wouldn’t say I’m an expert by any means. I use it every day. It’s an interesting kind of dichotomy of, I use Claude every day. I use ChatGPT every day. I use Whisper Flow every day, which is a cool new AI voice-to-text tool. And I feel like a novice, but then I step back and I’m, I feel like I’m getting into it.

Like 2025 for me was the year of prompt engineering, which I think is the most basic level of learning AI. A quick kind of story is always got frustrated with AI. I would jump into ChatGPT. I would have a project and say, all right, let’s use AI to do this project. And I would spend an hour or two on it and I’d get incredibly frustrated and say, AI is not for me. This is like 2024.

And then at the end of 2024 and into 2025, I pretty much cleared everything off my desk for three weeks and said, I’m just gonna, I’m gonna push through and like at least become a user of AI because if, I feel like if I don’t, I’m going to be left behind.

So I jumped into that prompt engineering and 2025 was the year for me of like prompt engineering and mega prompts and really getting into that and custom GPTs for little workflows. And then probably at the beginning of Q4 2025, I decided I was going to make the switch from ChatGPT to Claude.

So I created all Claude custom projects for all of my different areas of work and my workflows. And we were discussing this before we, we jumped on, started getting into Twitter threads on vibe coding and seeing all the buzz and the hype about building your own agents, building your own web apps, the democratization, if that’s a word, of software development.

And said, all right, I’m gonna, I’m gonna jump into vibe coding and was reading and watching YouTube videos and still haven’t jumped in, but I discovered tangentially at that point Claude Skills.

[00:07:16] Brian Searl: Yep.

[00:07:17] Matt Whitermore: And decided that was a good interim step was to convert all of my workflows and projects that were in Claude projects over to Claude Skills, which seem a lot more precise and systematic.

I had an unsophisticated approach of, this is what I’m working on. I’m gonna start a Claude project. I’m gonna dump a bunch of files into the project files. I’m gonna put some messy instructions in the project instructions and like just go to town. And like it worked pretty well. It worked pretty well.

And then I started reading and watching more videos and learning about the syntax of how AI reads and parses data and reads files and just started incrementally optimizing. All right, I’m gonna optimize my project instructions. I’m gonna optimize I learned what a markdown file is. Like now it seems like a markdown file is like what we should all know and that’s just what technology is these days.

So it’s, I still feel like I’m scratching the surface, but honestly it’s been life changing. I set up a treadmill in my basement with a TV and I bring my laptop down and with Whisper Flow, so I don’t type anymore.

I am just talking back and forth to Claude Skills, walking on the treadmill because I have 17 feet of snow outside in, in Syracuse. And just back and forth chatting with Claude via Whisper Flow and it feels pretty life changing honestly.

[00:08:52] Brian Searl: Are you, when you build your skills, this is, let me re, let me start back here. So for all of you who are watching the show, understand that because AI is moving so fast, because there are so many different layers for you to discover. There are, like I have no life, I’m a geek. I’ve done this since 2020. There’s still probably 3,000 things that I don’t know and there will be 6,000 tomorrow. The, what we’re trying to get you guys all to do is just start, like Matt did. Because if you don’t start by the time, which we’re really already here, that you have to be in AI, it’s going to be so overwhelming. There are going to be so many things that you have to do that you’ll never, ever catch up.

Like I feel like I’m behind and I’ve been doing this for four years. Five years. Really hit hard though November when ChatGPT came out of 2022.

So like Matt, I’m curious with your skills then, which is a feature of Claude and basically what they are abilities for, so let’s say you have a standard practice of SOP in your business, the way that you create your SOPs. Normally you would have to go to ChatGPT and you could just say, here’s what I want to write an SOP for, and it would do a good job. But the next conversation you have, it would do the SOP in a slightly different format.

So the way that Claude Skills helps is you create a skill that teaches Claude how you want all of your SOPs done, and then it will load that skill and it will write all the SOPs that you ask it for in the future in that same format. That’s one example of many.

[00:10:15] Matt Whitermore: Yep.

[00:10:15] Brian Searl: Are you writing your own SOPs though still? Or your own skills, Matt?

[00:10:20] Matt Whitermore: Yes. And like I will say the most impactful skill that I created was just out of necessity and out of frustration. You alluded to it that I have 25 different Claude projects. They all have a hundred different chats in them. And it’s so hard to keep track of the context and like you’re chatting back and forth with Claude and you’re coming to conclusions and you’re making decisions.

And so what I did was I created a project management skill that really forces the chat into creating a properly formatted markdown artifact and keeps forcing it back into editing that artifact with tracked changes, a change log, and like the clean version and then the tracked changes version because I kept driving, I would do a whole day’s worth of work on Claude and then I would write it misses, it forgets its own context.

So it would spit something out at you and you’re like, and I’m like, you missed it. You just missed it. Like I, and then I would feel like I just wasted my whole day and that I can’t trust it to remember its own context.

[00:11:30] Brian Searl: It’s hard. It’s memory, it’s, the memory is a weak point. I’ll share something when we get to it down the road that I’ve done that you guys will think is absolutely insane. But the context is the weak part, for sure.

Claude is pretty good at searching past conversations. I don’t know if you figured that out yet. So you can say, hey, we talked about this, can you go find the conversation where we did and then extract all the information you need.

But make sure you’re not letting it compact a conversation. Say, go look at the actual conversation cause if you get real long, I don’t know if you’ve noticed that, it’ll compact it.

[00:11:57] Matt Whitermore: Yes.

[00:11:57] Brian Searl: Which just means it takes like 10 pages of what you said and compacts it into five lines, which means it’s stupid again. So you have to, but the files are there. You can tell it to go uncompact it. You can actually tell it to do that.

But with skills specifically probably make it, maybe gonna save your life here, Matt. Claude has a skill to make skills.

[00:12:19] Matt Whitermore: Yes.

[00:12:20] Brian Searl: So if you just tell Claude to make me a skill with this information, it will package it and do everything correctly and you have to click a button and add it to skill.

[00:12:26] Matt Whitermore: It keeps, I’m always reminding it like, no, use the skill creator skill. Cause it gives me, it packages as a certain type of file that is a skill file, but it keeps trying to give it to me in just a normal markdown file.

[00:12:40] Brian Searl: Oh yeah.

[00:12:41] Matt Whitermore: Here’s the skill you made. And I’m like, that’s not a skill. And so then it goes back and redoes it all. Like you have to remind it to use the skill.

[00:12:48] Brian Searl: Are you using Opus 4.5?

[00:12:50] Matt Whitermore: Yes.

[00:12:51] Brian Searl: Okay. Yeah. I don’t know. I’ve never had that issue, but…

[00:12:54] Matt Whitermore: Always with skills. It’s here’s the skill mark.

[00:12:56] Brian Searl: I haven’t built that many to be honest with you. And I’ll, like when I tell you what I’ve done later in the show, if we get to that, then you’ll be like, oh, that’s why.

But they’re really good. They’re right. Like they’re one of the, and I think I read somewhere that ChatGPT is thinking about introducing skills in some capacity and some other places are too. So it’s just a good interim step like you’re talking about cause no, who has time to vibe code?

Most of these, most of the people on the show and the people watching the show don’t even have time to learn Claude Skills.

[00:13:23] Matt Whitermore: Right.

[00:13:23] Brian Searl: But Mychele has been learning maybe how to vibe code. Didn’t you say that before the show? Do you want to talk about that, Mychele?

[00:13:28] Mychele Bisson: No, cause I feel like I’m dumb now again. Matt just talked and I was like, what is he talking about?

[00:13:34] Matt Whitermore: Hey, I’ll give you a demo anytime.

[00:13:36] Mychele Bisson: Oh my gosh. I actually had to look up Claude cause I was like, I’ve never heard of this.

But we’re in the process of revamping all of our SOPs and stuff and we have our own system internally that we work with that we can add it all and then implement all the AI and stuff like that together so that we can all because we’re all in different places like you guys are. And as we’re adding everything together, it just blends it all together and then we refine it.

But now I’m like, God, I feel like I’m in the 1800s at this point.

[00:14:04] Matt Whitermore: Don’t feel bad cause I had to neglect all of my other responsibilities for about a month to dive in.

[00:14:10] Brian Searl: Does Robert know that? You just said that live on the show. I just want to check.

[00:14:13] Mychele Bisson: It’s probably for Robert’s benefit though.

[00:14:15] Brian Searl: Oh it is. I, yeah. It is for sure.

[00:14:18] Matt Whitermore: It is. And that’s where like our next step is looking at it from the company level, which is a whole different beast. So bringing on consultants to set the direction and set the strategy and the approach and the policy. There’s so much to consider in terms of like shadow AI, right?

Now that’s a huge thing. All, we’re all members of organizations or employees at organizations and we’re using AI and there’s maybe company stuff that’s, you’re doing your best to do your job, but that’s a security concern. And there’s so much that I think people don’t really think about yet.

So we’re dialing it way back and starting from like point zero of what’s our company approach, stance, what tools are we gonna use, implementing like a, an actual like enterprise account. Just really starting basic and trying to approach it the right way and just setting like a 2026 roadmap and beyond for what kind of things do we want to automate, what initiatives are on our radar in terms of what do we want to do with AI. So I’ve been excited to jump in there.

[00:15:30] Kurtis Wilkins: Yeah, I wanna talk about automation. Brian, and I know you deal with this too cause we’re of course automating lots of different processes there, but it’s, sometimes it isn’t a question of what you want to automate cause the answer is everything. It’s more of what are we in position to automate?

And cause I, you’re on the journey and the skills, I’m like, oh my gosh, I love like hearing that. That’s awesome. Brian loves hearing that too and I think everybody that’s listening to the show, go do that. That’s the beginning of the journey. And there’s 3,000 things, but I think when we talk about making it easy for people to understand it’s about feeding information in clean to AI.

Feed it in clean. And the only way you can feed it in clean is if you collect it clean. And then you’re going to always be tinkering with your prompt. I hopefully someday that’ll, hopefully that dies down someday. I doubt it. As the AI gets smarter, we just constantly are tinkering. Oh, do we want to change it from thee to the, right? I make the joke, but you’ll be doing those kinds of alterations.

And so I, that, I always, we approach it a little differently that way. We go, we’re in position to automate this particular process. I think about like our how we want to report on specific information. And that might be help your company just navigate those waters and make some decisions. So we have these data sets. I know we all want to do this project, but we have this stuff. 

[00:17:04] Brian Searl: That’s the hard part. I guess we do that. We consult for a lot of companies in the space, right? And we, they all want to automate everything. I want to automate everything, right? And the answer that I always tell them, and you guys know like we offer AI chatbots and the AI call agents, and that’s the easiest thing to tell people to start with.

But I’ll frequently get on the call with people and say, if customer service is not your problem right now, you should not start with that. You should start with whatever your biggest time suck is that’s causing you a headache or that if it takes it off your plate, then you can save two hours here or three hours there, whether that’s you or your GMs or your AGMs or whatever it is, right?

And then when you see, then when the company can see that buy-in of, oh, they just saved Mychele three hours or whatever, right? Then it’s, oh, I want to save three hours too. Let me look at, let me step back and look at my day from a holistic first principles perspective and say, this is what I do every day. Not through a lens of do I think it can be automated, but here’s what I do every day.

Let me go talk to the automation guy, whether that’s me or like Matt, you said you’re bringing in some consultants and things like that, whoever it is, and say, is it possible for me to do it, to automate this or to automate pieces of this to make it easier on me? Like HR is an easy one, right? So many job applications that everybody has out. Just taking a, something like that and analyzing it and weeding out all the candidates. You don’t have to read all the resumes.

[00:18:27] Matt Whitermore: Right.

[00:18:28] Sandrine Zechbauer: Where we’re jumping in… Oh go ahead. No, I was just gonna second your thoughts Brian here. AI is cool and it does help, but you, especially if you look at it from a company lens, which probably is where I’m coming from the most, but you’ve got to look at your problems. What are you trying to solve? Do you have, is your website not converting? Is your or your volume of calls too high? Is your guest experience poor? Then AI can help with that.

I would also say that for some of these problems, you don’t necessarily need to go into Claude and vibe codes. Anyway, it wouldn’t be my recommendation because you’re dealing with guest information, you’re dealing with guest data, you’re dealing with essentially quite critical information for your business. There are, I would obviously advocate for that given that I work for a software company, but there are software companies that specialize in that. I personally, for all these use cases, would not try and solve for it myself like through Claude or through Gemini or anything like this.

So I would look to the market and actually equip, I know it sounds like super obvious and you said like it is the first use case and still so many do not use it. There are still so few chatbots out there on, on RV property website. I have seen, I’ve not tried to ring so actually I could be mistaken, but when you phone a campsite out of hours, there’s very few that pick up through AI voice, which actually are products that are available out of the box today for a few hundred dollars a month. So it’s not going to break the bank and it will take you to market and have some deliverables quickly as opposed to starting your own vibe coding.

However, I do second your opinion also Matt like you do have to start yourself. So you can’t wait for your company to tell you what to do. Companies will move slower than individuals. And if you feel like we have our own initiatives at RMS around AI. And the reality is it feels overwhelming at the beginning. I was also building my own agent. I don’t have the level of proficiency that you seem to have Matt with Claude, although I was trying to do something with it earlier.

The best teacher for these software is the software. So if you do not know how to use Claude, the best place to find out is to actually ask Claude. Literally go in there, pay $20, because you almost always pay also, please always do not use free version because that are terrible. It sounds like Captain Obvious, but…

[00:21:01] Brian Searl: And you have ads soon too, which we can talk about at some point but yeah.

[00:21:05] Sandrine Zechbauer: So get the paid license and say, hey, how do you work? How can I do something? And guess what? It will actually tell you. So if you start with that, it feels a bit less overwhelming because I think at the beginning you may feel like, whoa, I don’t know all these terms. And actually you will be surprised how quickly proficient you become.

[00:21:27] Brian Searl: Yeah, I mean it’s just practice. Practice makes perfect. If you look at it from a, I have to learn all of these things that Brian is talking about, right? You’ll quickly get overwhelmed. But if you just jump into it and start talking to it, then you learn how to prompt like Matt did, then you take it to the next step and you learn Claude Skills and then you take it to the next step and right?

And you just move at your own pace. There’s no wrong way to do it if you’re playing with it. And doesn’t mean you always have to work with it either, right? It doesn’t mean I sit on my couch and I talk to AI all night. Not all night, but it’s if you’re sitting on your couch with your kids or your family, right?

Bring Disney into it, bring Pixar into it, have it write bedtime stories like even though that’s not what you’re doing for work, that still gives you practice and insight into how it responds and how to prompt and how to talk to it and all that stuff, right? It’s going to be like if there’s a child that’s under call it five years old today, they will never ever know a world where tens of millions of humanoid robots are walking around by the time they grow up. 

[00:22:27] Matt Whitermore: So funny that, I get nervous that I’m almost creating a dependency on myself. Like few times this month Claude had some serious outages. And like I’ve been waking up early to, to get my treadmill AI work in and then Claude’s down and it’s like I’m having like withdrawals. I’m like refreshing the screen like get back up.

[00:22:49] Brian Searl: So to your point though, like to answer your question about like business security and also that like we’re all going to build that dependency as a society, right? And there are different ways that you can handle it. There’s lots of studies out there that say people get dumber when they use AI. Of course they do. But people also get dumber using calculators. There’s just, there’s people who are going to use it to get dumber and there’s people who are going to use it to critical think. That has been with every technology throughout all of society. It’s just easy to pick on AI right now.

But to your point about dependencies, the way you make it more dependent and more secure and again, we’re talking about like several steps above where you’re at right now with Claude Skills, right? Is to use something like LM Studio is a good one, but if you have a powerful enough computer and you need a powerful one, don’t try to go buy a $400 Walmart laptop. Like you need something with a big GPU in it, like a graphics chip in it, right?

Like a tower, not a laptop. Then you can run some of these really powerful open source free models directly on your computer. And that’s where you want to store all your sensitive company data ideally in those models that are local that don’t go anywhere plus they don’t cost to use the API so they’re a lot more cost effective too.

[00:23:57] Matt Whitermore: Yeah. I saw somebody tweeted the other day that their prediction is that heavy LLM usage in three to five years is going to be like five to $10,000 a month. Their take was that all of our LLM usage is so heavily venture capital subsidized right now. That’s going to wear off and that like your $100 a month Claude usage is going to be thousands of dollars a month in three to five years. What do you think about that Brian?

[00:24:29] Brian Searl: But the models will be so much more smarter and so much more efficient and there’s still going to be that competition that races everything to the bottom because the AI manufacturers, and we could talk about this for a while, it’s not what direction we probably should take it in. But it’s a good thought to bring it up. I just mean we don’t want to talk about it forever.

I think it’s they’re going to make their money different ways. Like they’re not targeting a $200 billion software as a service market. They’re targeting a $7 trillion a year labor market. And whether we like that or not, I’m not saying I support that or want that, but that’s what they’re going after. So they’re going to make their money there.

Like they’re going to release scientific models that they can deploy to research labs. There was an article about this last week from OpenAI and they’re going to sign agreements with Pfizer and they’re going to say if you use one of our models to develop a drug, then we own a percentage of that drug and we get a percentage of those profits. That’s where they’re going to make their money.

[00:25:20] Matt Whitermore: Yeah.

[00:25:21] Brian Searl: The little people using the AI, I already spend five to $10,000 a month on API calls. But I don’t think that’s the just there wouldn’t be enough people who would use it at that point.

[00:25:29] Matt Whitermore: Fair.

[00:25:30] Brian Searl: But it’s a good I don’t know. I’m just guessing. What else we got guys?

[00:25:35] Kurtis Wilkins: I can, do you mind if I circle us back to an earlier topic? We were talking about deploying it internal teams and just I was just wanted to open it up to the floor. I have thoughts on it as well but where we talk about deploying small packages to help increase efficiencies. We said Mychele will save three hours a week because we deployed this particular package and I’m like, does anyone experience any resistance in that area?

[00:26:00] Brian Searl: From the employees you’re trying to automate?

[00:26:02] Kurtis Wilkins: We’re not trying to automate because we’re taking a very different approach and maybe I should just go into that approach.

[00:26:07] Brian Searl: From the task you’re trying to automate for the employees, yeah.

[00:26:09] Kurtis Wilkins: From the task I’m trying to automate but I make the joke to our team all the time that I don’t really see human exchange changing. I do see the expectations of that change or exchange. Expect that’s gonna go up dramatically. And so I think about it like I’m gonna buy a pencil from Amazon and Amazon’s gonna deliver it with a drone and it’s gonna sing a little tune about a pencil and I’m gonna go sweet, got my pencil. And I just say that’s very dumb. It’s unneeded. It’s unnecessary. But that’s what I mean by it’s just going to change the experience of something that is boring today where I just get a plain simple brown envelope and we’re going to make it into something better and we should be comparing that to like tasks that people are doing in our business. Right?

Because we’re in hospitality so everything we want to do needs to be, right? Beating drums, blowing trumpets, rolling out carpet. And that’s how I see this transition in our industry is just an expan- expansion of service. Each person will get so much just gonna develop into what they do for us. And that’s how I see these tools but and that’s how we’ve pitched it to the company, right? We’re automating these things but it’s so we can do other things really well. Like the thing that we spend five minutes on but we should spend an hour on. We want to figure out a way to get that hour. 

[00:27:30] Brian Searl: What do you guys think? Matt? Mychele? Sandrine?

[00:27:32] Mychele Bisson: I agree with that because I think that everything we do is based on hospitality and so if I’m freeing up my desk staff say on a busy weekend with check-ins and stuff like that so that they can actually have that one-on-one moment with somebody and give them that feel good, welcome back, this is home for you, let’s remember your name and all that stuff while all the backend stuff is happening on the computer, I think that’s what the whole system is about because we’re never going to get out of hospitality.

That’s what we’re here for and that’s what we’re built on. So I think there’s going to be things that will eventually be taken away from us so that we can just spend all of our time focused on the guest so that they get that feeling from us and that’s what these tools are meant for.

[00:28:19] Brian Searl: I think it’s really interesting because I think the definition of hospitality is going to change dramatically in people’s minds. And that doesn’t mean that people are going to want less communication with the staff at the campground. Some people will, some people won’t.

Which means that you’re still if you’re in the hospitality business you’re still going to need to have that personal touch there but maybe they won’t spend all of their eight hours a day with personal touch. Like I’ll give you a quick anecdote like I went to Ireland last year and we stayed in this super old Airbnb castle and there was a note there and the lady was like, if you want to meet us then we’re here. If you don’t want to meet us. And I went back and forth for two days we stayed there and I’m like I don’t know.

Like I really just I love that it’s a three room castle and I’m the only peo- people here because it was the off season, shoulder season, right? It was just cool to be all by myself and not feel like I know they’re there but and so I never met the hosts. But so I think you’re going to you’re going to see that wrestle with a lot of people’s minds as we move forward and I think that’s it’s going to change how they interact. Not that you don’t want to have that available but what they expect. Did you guys ever see that super old movie with Steven Spielberg called AI? Artificial Intelligence?

Do you remember anything about, I can’t remember the name of the kid who was in it. Super cute kid whatever back then he was anyway. I don’t know what he looks like now. It was like anyway it was it’s a really good movie. It’s called AI but in that movie there’s a kid that kid AI robot or whatever that ends up having a best friend that goes around him named Teddy and it’s a interactive like AI robot teddy bear. Super cute.

[00:29:46] Matt Whitermore: Haley Joel Osment, Brian.

[00:29:48] Brian Searl: Haley Joel Osment. Okay. And but this is what I mean. There’s going to be products like that where you can have a hike with your teddy bear when you go camping and people are going to be like, oh that’s interesting like maybe. But then there’s going to be also new services that come up where people just want to take a walk with a real human being around their neighborhood and there’ll be entrepreneurs that start that kind of service. So I think the way hospitality is defined is going to change. I think there’s always going to be a necessity to have some kind of personal touch somewhere from a human being but I don’t know what that looks like in 10 years. I don’t think anybody does.

[00:30:27] Kurtis Wilkins: Yeah Brian, I-

[00:30:28] Sandrine Zechbauer: Oh go-

[00:30:28] Brian Searl: Oh no you go.

[00:30:30] Kurtis Wilkins: I wanted to talk about the AI is going to make it’s gonna make the connections like our like day-to-day like your day-to-day interactions with individuals like we’re going to they’re start they’re going to start to get less and less. There’s gonna be less phone calls. There’s gonna be less human touch just in day-to-day operations, day-to-day whatever you’re doing in the world.

And so I almost take it’s an interesting when you say it’s going to become more and more because it’s choose your own adventure, right? That’s the best part about hospitality. It is choose your own adventure in camping. And I go I almost think that maybe camping it natively has this community aspect to it that where we do encourage a lot of communication between our guests and each other and I almost wonder if maybe that’s just like native to our customer base and my understanding. But I go that might be the customer base that we attract as an industry too.

And so part of me is there and I’m going so if we are if everything is getting less and less connected in maybe a more call it work-based but on their personal choice, like I if I had less interactions and I was more lonely at work I definitely choose to be more connected in my free time. But if I’m very connected during my work time, sometimes I choose to be a little bit more alone and I kind of gravitate towards the opposite. But that’s my personal journey. I’m not saying I speak for all humans. But I just wonder-

[00:31:57] Brian Searl: But you have to be ready for it at your campground, right? It is not like now you everybody, not everybody obviously. But at least the operators on this call and many people watching us do hospitality really well with in-person. But you’ve got to also be ready depending on your market and demographic and who you want to target obviously, this is campground by campground, right?

You’ve got to be ready to embrace the people who are not what you think your target market has always been. Like we released a really and we’re not here to talk about data but we released a really fascinating report last Friday on Gen Z where we did some deep dives and we looked at psychological papers. Insider Perks did this. It’s free. It’s a free download on our website. Where we looked at the real reasons why Gen Z isn’t camping. And they don’t want fast Wi-Fi. They don’t want to stay connected.

The whole industry and everything I’ve ever seen on Gen Z from KOA to sessions at shows to operators I’ve talked to is all like they just want all the new tech. That’s not what they actually want. And it’s very sim- there’s four different things they want. It’s a huge paper. I don’t want to get into it.

But one of the things is just we frequently bring up Earl from Black Folks Camp Too or I do and he’s got a great program and he and part of what he talks about and has talked about for years is that Black people are nervous to go into the outdoors partly because of their history but partly because they grew up in cities and weren’t exposed to this. And it’s the same thing with Gen Z. They’ve grew up with phones. They don’t have a comfort level with the outdoors. They don’t know how to start fires. And it makes them nervous. And they’ve been raised in a culture where they’re afraid to fail.

And so it’s just really interesting to look at some of this stuff and understand a different perspective. Almost the entire industry has grown up metaphorically with Boomers. And we’re still there. But the future, and this isn’t just Gen Z, this is as we just talked about, this is Black folks, this is anybody who’s been raised, this is Gen A that’s coming after them. They’re not returning to camping. KOA says 37% of Gen Zs are at risk. And the reason is because our campgrounds aren’t structured to welcome them. And it’s going to be the same way with however hospitality changes too. So you’re going to have to decide that as an operator. Who do I want to embrace? And there’s not going to be a wrong answer. There’s going to be a right one for you.

[00:34:10] Matt Whitermore: Yeah Kurtis, I loved your where you went with that. Two two interesting points is I think the perfect campground in today’s society offers both of the things that you were talking about. It offers solitude and quiet and I’ve been so dialed in all week and I want to just hear the birds and I want to look at the river or go for a hike and just have silence and forest bathe.

And then within the same campground you can serve the people who said I’ve been buried and locked into a spreadsheet for the last 70 hours and I need some human connection. And I think that’s what always when I think of the perfect campground it’s both of those things and I personally resonate with what you were talking about because I was that person. I was a financial analyst. I was living in a small apartment in Center City Philadelphia. It was I was working for a software company as a financial analyst. And so it was buried in spreadsheets, working remotely. This was 2018. Before everybody else most other people were working remotely.

And I would wake up, go to the apartment gym and then go sit at my desk that was in the corner of my living room and then I’d blink and it would be 6 p.m. and I’d be like I haven’t spoken to another human or gone outside. And that was like two that was like two years of that. And you know what I did? You know what I did to counteract that? I went and bought my first campground in the Catskill Mountains of New York where there were more black bears than people and I went out and I lived in the woods in a campsite and did honey wagon runs and checked people into their campsites and cleansed my brain from spreadsheets for the next two years because it’s a problem.

I think we’re lonelier than ever. We’re right, the word connection is so interesting in that we’re as connected digitally as ever but we’re also as disconnected as ever from human to human. I think people and then I just think it’s so interesting that was two years before the pandemic and then everyone had that experience had that shared human experience of gaining 20 pounds and getting depressed and like being as lonely as they’ve experiencing like a loneliness that they never could have imagined was possible.

And obviously camping was a big story of part of that after the shuffle of is it a essential business, is it not, are the campgrounds open, are they not, and figuring that out in the first few months. It was a historic time for our industry and I think we’ve got this big story of oh the business is normalized, the industry is normalized, we’re back to 2019 type numbers. And a lot of that’s true but I think there was a change in society in that people hung on to either right both things that you talked about Kurtis.

One is I want to go be alone in the woods. Like we see people with money, high income, highly paid professionals, entrepreneurs now love to go rough it in the woods and pitch their own tent. More than I think in probably in the last few decades. RVing is coming back. I think it’s changing. You talked about baby boomers, Brian. I think that’s a whole interesting evolution of the business. It’s conversion vans and pop-up campers and small travel trailers and it’s a really fascinating time to be in this industry and I think it’s there’s a lot going on and I don’t think anybody knows where we’re going really.

[00:37:52] Brian Searl: No, I don’t know where we’re going a year from now. But you but it’s a perfect example. We’ve solved it in camping, right? So like you just put a section of your campground like you were saying Matt as the ones who can be more human if that’s what people want and then an isolated section. And we already have taken all the lingo and we’ve made it happen. We just call it human in the loop.

[00:38:11] Matt Whitermore: I like that.

[00:38:14] Brian Searl: What do you think Sandrine?

[00:38:14] Sandrine Zechbauer: Actually I think if we think about AI and how is it going to is it going to take away from the human touch. But at some point in your booking journey or in your travel you just need information. You don’t necessarily want you know, do you have a pool? Is there a fire pit? Do you sell marshmallows? You don’t necessarily need the whole story. You just need an answer.

And I think for that AI is brilliant. And at some point you want you may not want that connection. The story kind of why they’re here, why your story Matt like why did you set this up? What are you trying to do? What’s the story or the vision behind the cape whatever that might be and the community of campers. Then obviously AI may right now it doesn’t do that. I think it does in Asia. I think some people are marrying some bots and stuff. I think for most folks that’s not on the cards. So I think…

[00:39:06] Brian Searl: Yet.

[00:39:06] Sandrine Zechbauer: Yet. Yeah that’s true. But maybe we’ll get married to our ChatGPT avatars.

[00:39:10] Brian Searl: I won’t be but don’t be surprised if you have a grandkid. I bet 30% of them are married to AIs if you have a grandkid right now.

[00:39:19] Sandrine Zechbauer: That’ll be interesting for our future customers cause that’s not going to reproduce very quickly but see how that goes.

[00:39:25] Brian Searl: That’s a whole another yeah. That’s a different podcast.

[00:39:28] Sandrine Zechbauer: We won’t be here. But yeah I think there is AI can supplement without taking away. I’m French so my level of expectations of service isn’t as good as what you would expect in America. You’re lucky in almost hotel if French people answer you. So I would take, that sounds really bad but it, unless I pay literally top dollar for a five star property in which case they couldn’t do more for you.

If it’s I might get some death threats after this but if it’s anything like a campsite anything beyond ultra luxury you’re gonna get a very average service. At this point I’m quite happy if I get my answer and it comes from a bot. I’m quite happy with that. I’m as long as I can do what I want. I have my information. I can check in, check out, do my payment. I’m good. Like I know where everything’s at. I know if there is a class of yoga that I want to take. That this is good and AI can answer all of this. I wouldn’t get more necessarily from a human. It is not true in America where your service is always good.

[00:40:38] Brian Searl: I don’t necessarily agree with that.

[00:40:40] Mychele Bisson: No.

[00:40:41] Sandrine Zechbauer: In my experience it’s good. Like your service is better than French service. Like it’s just let’s say but it’s also the truth. So I think there’s sometimes where like the human side isn’t that isn’t always that great either. And an AI that understands my accent and can answer me potentially even in my language is amazing. It can be amazing. So I’m all for it.

[00:41:06] Matt Whitermore: Yeah. Totally agree with you Sandrine there. I think having called I don’t know probably thousands of campgrounds either to book sites as a real customer or as a secret shopper to try and figure out if the campground’s for sale. And the standard is that you don’t get a call back for five days or three weeks sometimes. 

[00:41:24] Brian Searl: Or ever. Yeah.

[00:41:25] Matt Whitermore: To your point, to have an AI answer the phone and actually get you the information that you’re looking for even if it’s a little choppy and it takes a minute and it stutters and it makes you feel awkward, when the alternative is you never get that information, that is absolutely hospitality. And I struggled with that for so long of no this is a human old fashioned business. I don’t want a robot answering the phone. I’ve completely changed my tune on that. Yeah.

[00:41:52] Sandrine Zechbauer: Yeah. It’s still better. It’s still an answer. I still get my answer. To ring you back tomorrow. I don’t have to ring you back when you’re open because I might be working. So that is definitely being hospitable as well I suppose.

[00:42:04] Brian Searl: You don’t have to go to your competitor either because you didn’t answer.

[00:42:08] Sandrine Zechbauer: Exactly. See that all the time. All the time.

[00:42:10] Kurtis Wilkins: We, you, I, matt, Mychele, you guys might have different stats than me. Brian you might have different stats than me, but I if you don’t answer that phone you have two minutes and that’s about how much time it takes them to find another campground to call.

[00:42:26] Matt Whitermore: Yeah. 100%.

[00:42:27] Kurtis Wilkins: And so I also wonder if that leads to the problem in our industry as well right where we talk about it is a problem that they don’t call back but I bet a lot of these like campgrounds that aren’t maybe staffed to the level that they want to be or they don’t have the systems in place. They don’t use Brian’s AI call center agent.

When they miss a call they’ve probably been burned a lot because they have called back and then you learn they we it’s almost like a self-fulfilling prophecy right? Like most of the time when they call back it’s not worth their time because they’ve already booked at another campground and you just hear these you hear that how many times as a campground owner before you all of a sudden just go okay. That’s not profitable. I’m just gonna stop doing that voicemail and only deal with my long-term customers. I don’t know. That’s me speculating. I don’t…

[00:43:15] Brian Searl: another thing people aren’t thinking about is what happens when the AI makes phone calls for people. Because nobody very few people actually want to talk on the phone. And so you’re already seeing this Google already has these features in search for a limited number of restaurants I think. But you’re going to eventually have the ability for your AI to call parks and get the information because let’s be honest, these campgrounds that you’re acquiring Matt and Mychele and Kurt, like you are acquiring them for many reasons but some of them might be related to the fact that they’ve done no marketing and it’s all upside if you just put a little bit of work into it right?

But even if you make even if you have a good website there’s so much information about your campground and what you can do there in the local area and stuff that most parks don’t put on their website. The only way you can get that information is to either go or to call. So there’s going to be a huge increase I think in the volume of calls to parks despite all the technology available but it’s going to be AI calling. Because you can say AI find me a campground near Bend Oregon for example.

And it will go and it will call 200 parks within a 150 mile radius of Bend Oregon instead of the three that the human being would have called. Who’s answering all those calls?

[00:44:24] Sandrine Zechbauer: Exactly.

[00:44:24] Brian Searl: If you’re already short staffed.

[00:44:26] Matt Whitermore: You have agent to agent conversations going on. Would be crazy.

[00:44:31] Kurtis Wilkins: Would it be a would it be a phone call or would it be like I look at RMS is like a right is a great solution here and Sandrine sorry maybe if I’m stealing your thunder but wouldn’t you want to expose I we own a property management system as well and like the way we talk about it is we’re trying to figure out how to expose endpoints to these agents to so that we don’t even have to have the phone call. Like here’s everything you need.

[00:44:54] Brian Searl: You want to do that but we’re talking about the level of Matt last year and Matt this year and then going to that right? So we’re a ways away from campground like the intermediary step is something else. But you’re not wrong with your thinking.

[00:45:05] Sandrine Zechbauer: Yes. Should. And we work with a partner called Myma that does all the chatbots, AI chatbots for us like you know in all languages and all sort. And they were pulling out some stats for us. And basically the top 20 questions is like the for every property and they might be different right property by property but roughly the top 20 questions come up 80% of the time.

So it’s not even that complex. It’s when’s the pool open? Do you have what facilities do you have in your kitchen? Do you sell firewood? All these things. Roughly the top 20 question is 80% of the volume. So this is really where at some point if somebody picks up the phone like there’s only so many times you can say yes the pool’s open from whatever.

This is where AI really so first off you should really expose this in your website in the first place so that actually it that feeds the AI searches but that’s another sort of more marketing conversation but if you do not then at least have something for people to find that information straight away because it does feel like a missed opportunity to not have any solution. And there are so many still that don’t like talk about that’s not even AI just the booking engine like I don’t know how that’s supposed to…

[00:46:19] Brian Searl: Don’t have their photos and site types and descriptions and all that yeah.

[00:46:23] Sandrine Zechbauer: That’s the bookings for you like of course we can phone but that is really. And we see still a lot of properties with nothing just Excel spreadsheets still and no particular way of enhancing that experience that I’m guessing these are the parks that you guys buy. But Sandrine you feel free to send all of those to me and then Matt don’t worry I’ll forward the one I’ll forward them to you.

[00:46:48] Brian Searl: You’re not wrong like it’s an intermediary step right now right? It’s very easy to go to Google and look up a company like Chatbase and get a chatbot up and running that’ll run like the top 20 or 50 frequently asked questions that you have right? It’s a whole different ballgame when agents start calling your park on behalf of the woman who has a seven-year-old daughter who you know and then it needs more information about your playground right?

Because the agent can gather that and talk more quickly to an agent or to a human if you’re overstaffed. Because then it’s going to know that this seven-year-old girl likes to stay out in the sun longer than she should and she doesn’t love to put on sunscreen so do you have a metal side or metal slide or a plastic slide? And she’s tend to like being a little bit more clumsy than the other neighbor girls so she might fall. Do you have mulch or do you have pavement underneath your playground? And it’s going to start to ask all these questions and you’re going to have to be prepared for that. Right now it’s 20. It’s the easy we’re in the easy spot right now.

[00:47:36] Sandrine Zechbauer: Yeah. Correct. But it will complexify and guest experiences or guest expectations will only increase. Like it is normal. I do not have any patience. I would not call back ever. I’ll be like, nah, so missed it.

[00:47:56] Brian Searl: All right let’s spend the last few minutes of the show we’re going to do our typical ask everybody gets to ask everybody else a question. So maybe we’ll start with Mychele. Mychele just pick anybody from Matt, Kurt, Kurtis or Sandrine. You can ask a question if you want and then we’ll follow on from that person but everybody can only be asked a question one time so once somebody asks Mychele a question nobody else can ask Mychele a question. So Mychele go first. Who would you like to pick?

[00:48:17] Mychele Bisson: My gosh you put me on the spot.

[00:48:20] Brian Searl: Ask a question to anybody.

[00:48:21] Kurtis Wilkins: Wait could I clarify is Brian in the circle?

[00:48:23] Brian Searl: No Brian is not in the circle.

[00:48:25] Kurtis Wilkins: Brian is not in the circle.

[00:48:25] Brian Searl: You guys have more interesting things than I have to say.

[00:48:28] Mychele Bisson: Okay Matt. If you were to suggest as a newbie to go into learning this skill which would be the first AI system that you feel like would be a good start for somebody?

[00:48:39] Matt Whitermore: This is really great question Mychele. I would say ChatGPT because I believe they have the best resources available in terms of courses, like actual OpenAI courses and YouTube videos and resources.

And that’s someone who’s migrated away from ChatGPT. I wish Claude had better versions of that but I think an LLM is an LLM so if you learn one you’re learning a lot of great stuff for the other one so that’s I’ve thought of actually thought about that a lot and that’s that was my conclusion is that ChatGPT is the best for a beginner because of the resources available.

[00:49:24] Brian Searl: All right Matt who do you want to ask a question to?

[00:49:28] Matt Whitermore: Good question.

[00:49:29] Brian Searl: It might be we don’t know your question yet. Getting egotistical Matt.

[00:49:35] Matt Whitermore: No I meant you it’s a good question.

[00:49:37] Brian Searl: I know what you meant Matt. I’m just messing with you.

[00:49:41] Matt Whitermore: Sandrine I would say being obviously in the tech world are you seeing it right that I guess a brief statement before the question to add some context. In my kind of trying to learn the basics of AI and feeling like I jumped in without really knowing what AI is one of my bigger conclusions has been that really the reason that all of us should care as consumers on the consumer level or B2B consumers should care about AI is because of what it does for our tech providers in terms of being able to iterate and ship updates and build new features and products so much more quicker and more efficiently.

Are you seeing that internally at RMS and among your peers and everything that is that right? Like I literally Googled earlier today we were having a conversation like is it normal for a software engineer to default to vibe coding? And it was a mixed answer. It was like, not quite but almost. So I’m I just for as a person on the inside of the technology side I’d love to get your kind of what’s your perspective and view on that?

[00:50:57] Sandrine Zechbauer: Yeah I think if you’re not on board you have a very quick risk of going extinct and that’s as a company the way we operate the same guys you operate and also specifically around the product. There is obviously there is the belief that we spend 40 years building this nobody could take come and copy it all in a day a 15-year-old kid with a Claude license.

And of course some of it is true like it wouldn’t be possible. However we are now the CPO of RMS is putting AI first. We had this major initiative to really think about where can we it’s exactly what you say is where can we accelerate? How can we improve the design? How can we ship faster? We already know what we want to work on like we know what our customers are struggling with. We know what they want. So we want to use this as a fail fast ship fast type of approach.

So it is actually very honestly even in just in two years how much it’s changed in the way we think before you needed you’ll need to launch something else you would have need another engineer and that would have been a wreck and that would have been a whole thing and now it’s just no probably how can AI do that? So we’re doing things like the team is going on the ground gonna spend three days with a customer somewhere in Australia, don’t remember where. And they’re just gonna relook at the at some of the modules and be like okay how do you use this? How can we vibe and actually just do it there and then and by the end of it hopefully just have a whole new housekeeping module reprototyped and ready to try.

So I think it’s that type of work that is coming out and is really interesting but it’s for us it’s not a maybe we’ll look at it maybe we’ll see where it goes maybe we won’t go anywhere maybe I’ll just look at it next year for us it’s like a mandate we have to have it.

[00:52:48] Matt Whitermore: Awesome. Super interesting.

[00:52:51] Brian Searl: All right Sandrine you have Kurtis or Mychele?

[00:52:54] Sandrine Zechbauer: Oh yeah. I’ll go ladies because I have to. It’s just the nature. So Mychele, said it for me from more from my background so you obviously the CEO of this Bison Peak Venture like why did you get into it and why do you still love what you do? I know it’s not AI related but I just would like to know.

[00:53:12] Mychele Bisson: Actually I was a real estate investor for years and so I have portfolios of long-term rentals I have boutique resorts I have all kinds of things that play in the background and about a couple years ago I jumped into my first campground thinking oh this will be a great investment and then just fell in love with it. I loved it I fell in love with the hospitality of it, getting to be able to sit around and meet the guests that were there and it just became this thing that was bigger than myself and that’s why I got into campground investing was because it was just I saw the opportunity to create something that was making core memories for families basically.

Giving people something bigger to give them that moment to disconnect as we talked about earlier and to really connect. I know for us COVID was a pivoting moment for a lot of people. My husband was in a large international business. He was one of the leads in North America and doing something that brought him back home where we could do something together was really important to me. And we were able to retire him out of his W-2 and have him jump into it with me and now we work together and we’re always together and we both love it. I love it. I think he loves it. He’s not on this call so we say so I’ll never tell you otherwise. I’ll tell you that. I think but giving everybody else an opportunity and having kids that are graduating my last my baby just got accepted into the University of Virginia so she’s leaving next year. Thank you. She also got a full ride Naval ROTC scholarship 

[00:54:38] Brian Searl: awesome. Congratulations.

[00:54:39] Mychele Bisson: I feel like I got a pay raise. Just knowing the memories that I had with my kids and knowing that I get to provide that for other families. I know not every campground is built for that but those are what my campgrounds are built for. Just knowing that I get to provide that for other families means a lot to me.

[00:54:55] Brian Searl: All right last but not least does anybody we’re odd man out here does anybody have a question they want to ask Kurtis? Whoever wants to go first. Somebody must have a question for Kurtis. He’s got so much knowledge locked up in his head.

[00:55:09] Mychele Bisson: I know he says smart.

[00:55:10] Sandrine Zechbauer: Kurtis I don’t know much about this algo. I don’t know much about this. It looks like everybody’s buying all these campground. So can you tell me just a bit about like current state of the campground market? Is this a is this where I should invest instead of AI? Should I get my money and get myself a US park?

[00:55:28] Kurtis Wilkins: No. Just no. Okay that was not the question I was expecting to get but thoughts on it.

[00:55:33] Brian Searl: Maybe we’re obviously just listening to the podcast in our audio and didn’t see that.

[00:55:37] Kurtis Wilkins: No I was like okay real estate market as a whole in the United States is actually a really good time to be buying real estate. Interest rates are historically high right? So that means real estate values are suppressed. We’re also seeing like a transition away from and there’s like disruption going on in real estate whether that’s apartments long term so I actually am very bullish on real estate right now because it’s in a cycle moment and you’re going to get a lot of compression from that long term. So the answer on real estate is yes.

Now campground industry specifically I’m in it I’m always bullish on it. I don’t care if we were at the highs of 2022 or now there’s room to grow there’s room everywhere in the campground industry to improve just because it has been in the I’m going to call it Boomers hands for so long in this like we talk about like the bar of hospitality in our industry and this group of people here is very critical of that so I always take us with a grain of salt. Because we all service hundreds of thousands of people every year and we only deal with 2,000 complaints. That’s what this group like talks about every day.

But yeah overall bullish I would recommend if you are going to buy a campground I like to see campgrounds that you are either very boutique and niche and you’re servicing a very particular clientele or you’re on the little bit of the larger side in terms of like commoditization of the product right? Like a hotel. Boutique hotels 20 30 doors they do very well. Hotels over 150 doors do really well. Don’t try not to fall in that middle ground or else you’re we’re positioning and we’re doing a lot of work for that in that zone. But overall yes. Love the industry.

[00:57:19] Brian Searl: I want to add one thing to that and say Sandrine do you have you heard of the Glamping Industries Trade Association in UK?

[00:57:26] Sandrine Zechbauer: I have heard of them. We’re not a member of them. I’m a we’re a member of the American one. I was looking at them are they good? I was going to say who knows but…

[00:57:32] Brian Searl: they’re new but I’ve talked to John and I’m a member although I think I haven’t paid my dues. Anyway I’m gonna be a member if I’m not already officially. But it’s a good organization and they wrote a the reason I brought them up is because they had a really interesting post on LinkedIn the other day about the state of the caravan market in the UK and how they’re it’s not as built out.

[00:57:48] Sandrine Zechbauer: That’s true that’s I have seen that actually it came up in my feed.

[00:57:52] Brian Searl: So I think the path to ownership for you in the UK is might be radically different and easier than it is in the US.

[00:57:57] Sandrine Zechbauer: Oh yeah legit especially now but I would 100% do that. It’s good I’ll work on my second career plans. Do like you own a campground. That’ll be good. Put all the tech in.

[00:58:10] Brian Searl: All right we’re a little bit over here so Mychele where can they learn more about what you have going on?

[00:58:13] Mychele Bisson: They can always find me on Instagram @MycheleBisson. I have my own YouTube channel where I talk about things, all things campground and you can always find me on my webpage at MycheleBisson.com.

[00:58:24] Brian Searl: Awesome thanks for being here Mychele. Matt. Where can they find out more about what you have?

[00:58:29] Matt Whitermore: Yes you can follow me on LinkedIn pretty active there. I’ve got a newsletter called Outdoor Hospitality Weekly. Do a podcast there as well. So yeah you can find me on Twitter, LinkedIn, Matt Whitermore, whitermore@unhitchedrv.com you can email me anytime.

[00:58:45] Brian Searl: Thanks Matt. Appreciate you being here. Kurtis.

[00:58:48] Kurtis Wilkins: You can find me at ourjourney.com and aom or advancedoutdoormanagement.com both those places you can get a hold of Kurtis and then you could also find me on LinkedIn as well Kurtis Wilkins.

[00:58:59] Brian Searl: Awesome thanks for being here Kurtis. And Sandrine last but not least.

[00:59:02] Sandrine Zechbauer: Yes on LinkedIn of course but it’s my name is difficult so good luck. Try Sandrine Z that might land and then on the website obviously rmscloud.com I’m there as well so not difficult to find. Love to connect.

[00:59:17] Brian Searl: Awesome thank you guys all for being joining us for another episode of MC Fireside Chats. If you’re not tired of hearing about me or hearing from me we’re going to be on another podcast in about 55 minutes with Scott Bahr from Cairn Consulting Group where we talk about some data some new numbers that have come out and obviously the latest news and about AI and some more geeky stuff we’ll go into there and we’ll drink beer and have fun. Other than that we’ll see you on a next episode of MC Fireside Chats. Take care guys I appreciate you all.

[00:59:41] Mychele Bisson: Bye guys.

[00:59:42] Everyone: Thank you.